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Thread: My suggestion for realistic melee

  1. #1

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    David Dire's Avatar
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    My suggestion for realistic melee

    To me, I would prefer it was made basically unrewarding no matter the situation to go into melee. Seeing as it has been implied that will be impossible, here are a couple other suggestions I have for melee itself:

    -Reduce usage of the bayonet, E.G. make it so even with bayonets fixed, besides an initial charge, clubbing will be much more popular than bayoneting and will not be a one hit kill either, possibly even taking a good 3 wooden smacks to knock out an enemy. This could be accomplished by making bayonet thrusts easily, easily parry-able. Or just the attack itself being randomized in type with a preference to clubbing.

    This is based on historically sources, at least the ones I've seen, as well as Civil War research in general, I can't find evidence that bayonet victims outnumbered or equal clubbed victims.

    -"Suppression" in melee?
    Sounds pretty weird, though it would be yet another incentive to reduce melee without destroying it. Suppression would theoretically keep melee quick and decisive, else the winners (or losers, if they live) will be more or less unable to fight for a good 20 seconds or so after the combat or during it.

    -Sticks!
    https://youtu.be/888_Gxybdtw?t=236
    http://i.imgur.com/STUHVb8.png

  2. #2
    WoR-Dev TrustyJam's Avatar
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    Thank you for the suggestions.

    Quote Originally Posted by David Dire View Post
    -"Suppression" in melee?
    Sounds pretty weird, though it would be yet another incentive to reduce melee without destroying it. Suppression would theoretically keep melee quick and decisive, else the winners (or losers, if they live) will be more or less unable to fight for a good 20 seconds or so after the combat or during it.
    That one is a pretty interesting one to me as it can be experimented with far quicker than the (planned to be part of the system) timing based parry option (or a complex individual & team tracking system needed to do calculations for a suggested morale system for that matter). Another addition to it could be an introduction of a random element to simulate how the horror (as rightly pointed out by Mr. Poorlaggedman) of warfare, and especially close up and personal in a melee effects people differently. This could be effectively different levels of suppression/fatigue/panic given at a random to you if you indeed gut a man. The different levels would thus span a quite large amount of time, making melee something no one ever knows how will turn out before they are right in it.

    - Trusty

  3. #3

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    I like the idea of it, After playing Warband since 2012 i no longer want to be in a game that is all about melee I want to be able to march in a line and fire my musket untill i die or even the enemy or my line routs.
    [17thMS(A)] Pvt. Jack Woods

  4. #4

    USA Lieutenant Colonel

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    Also find the idea of melee suppression interesting, but it'd be hard to do right (less accuracy/power in swings?) along with effects similar to normal suppression?

  5. #5

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    +1 to OP and to Trusty

  6. #6

    CSA Major

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    It sure does seem interesting. Many times when we charge, neither side will stop. Either the attackers get killed, or the Defenders get killed. If a bayonet charge happens, rarely do I see anyone run away.

  7. #7

    CSA Major General

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    definitely on the right track here... I like it.
    All governments, everywhere derived its power by the consent of the people. The government you have is by your own consent. Not by those brave grey dead of one hundred and fifty plus years ago.

  8. #8
    I don't like the suppression effects in this game as far as the artillery and what's going on when friendlies fire a volley. There is a lot of stuff you can do. I think it's safe to assume you're at a high likelihood of dealing with tunnel vision if you go into hand-to-hand combat with someone. Some variance in the meelee attacks and the power of them would be great. Not every 'hit' thrust should kill a guy and throw him five feet (I know that's an engine problem). It's too easy, too predictable. Sometimes you should have your suggestion happen, other times you shouldn't. The unpredictability is a deterrence. A safer approach to avoid that for a player should be clubbing and they should be separate meelee attacks even with a bayonet fixed.

    I can hardly imagine someone getting skewered like the default play style. Meelee is the toughest thing to get 'right' realistically and the easiest to screw up. It doesn't matter so much when everyone's spitting 100 bullets out a minute. At 3 bullets a minute, it matters quite a bit.

    In my strong opinion, I think that there should be a premium on forcing friendly players to group up closely.... less erratic sprinting about around the enemy's screen edges and more focus on staying close to friendlies to be more imposing. With strong functioning penalties (including autosurrender) for people who are isolated. So that both sides see the advantage of slowing the concept of meelee down into a maneuver rather than a skewering contest. the idea that a formation of men, each would split on his own to go on a stabbing slaughter of each other is absurd. I can think of a lot of excuses to not sprint into that as a living, breathing person. The gamer has nothing better to do in that moment than cave to the instant kill/die mayhem that leaves four survivors standing around from the two teams combined. To do otherwise would just not be accepting the reality of what the game is. So the game has got to change to get different results.
    Last edited by Poorlaggedman; 09-08-2017 at 03:40 AM.

  9. #9
    WoR-Dev TrustyJam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Poorlaggedman View Post
    Some variance in the meelee attacks and the power of them would be great. Not every 'hit' thrust should kill a guy and throw him five feet (I know that's an engine problem).

    In my strong opinion, I think that there should be a premium on forcing friendly players to group up closely....
    Thanks for the suggestions.

    Variance in melee damage could quite easily be tested out.

    We're actively working on tight group play advantages. Which you'll hopefully see in their first iteration in the alpha in the not too distant future.


    - Trusty

  10. #10

    USA Lieutenant Colonel

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    Might be an idea to make it so that only charged melee attacks will be an instant Kill (Like sprinting with the Weapon primed for melee for 1.5 seconds or something). This would encourage actual Bayonet charges and the resulting Melee would be less predictable.

    It's strange, people barely bother with it in RO2 but it's probably one of the most powerful Weapons in close quarters (due to just instantly killing by just tapping the button). I remember literally clearing buildings by just getting behind the enemy team and methodically melee'ing everyone inside, obviously in WOR it's more prevalent due to primarily 1 shot Weapons.

    in the mod IOM it melee would come into play more because of increased numbers of forced Bolt action rifles, but even then people would still prefer to shoot before trying Melee.
    Last edited by R21; 09-08-2017 at 06:29 AM.

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