View Poll Results: A good addition to WOR?

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  • Yes

    61 65.59%
  • No

    26 27.96%
  • I have my own ideas on the subject

    6 6.45%
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Thread: Segmented Reloading

  1. #41

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    Quote Originally Posted by dmurray6 View Post

    I think this would provide awesome opportunities for soldiers to accidentally load multiple rounds. For example, they complete steps 1 and 2, and then retreat a decent distance on the battlefield, only to start their reload process over again with step1. Now two cartridges have been rammed. Would provide a great moment to implement a variation of a rifle fire that has two rounds and double powder. Also, I think the segmented reload provides the ability to better react to officer commands. I've been stuck on multiple occasions in the middle of a "fire at will" situation, where then a retreat command or another tactical decision has been made where I need to relocate. I have to either abandon my reload or let it finish. Either way something sucks, I'm either losing a partial reload or I'm disobeying the command to move as a unit.

    In the interest of establishing talking points in defense of a segmented reload, I'd be willing to bet that the reload process was interrupted quite often. This is not an invitation for all forum members to try and prove to me that it was or was not by sending me book quotes and references. Unless you were standing on the field in a battle line (not a reenacator), I don't need to hear your evidence. It's not a concept that can be adequately proven at this point. its just a logical thought. But if you believe that every soldier during the Civil War that started a rifle reload actually finished 100% of the time, well then......I don't know how to respond without chalking up a forum violation!

    I personally don't find a requirement to hit 1,2,3 to reload my weapon any more difficult or annoying as having to remember which function keys to hit to perform any of the other motions in-game (salute and all the others). Only segmenting the reload process would provide a better time to observe your surroundings before beginning the next step. I find trying to use the free-look (alt) key just as annoying as watching my head change directions during the reload. I think its fairly impossible to keep track of an approaching enemy using free-look while loading. So I'd likely look around (if the situation called for it) between steps 1, 2, and 3, if the reload was to become segmented.
    +1, my thoughts exactly.

    Double and triple loading should definitely be a thing, it's kind of like it's own reward system (you reload properly and don't do it, you don't get the negative effects, if you constantly forget and accidentally double and triple load it speeds up the rate at which your Gun fouls immensley along with the shots themselves being innaccurate and having massive recoil) which could also make stage 2 (Ramming) take longer.

    As for head bobbing/Freelook during Reloading, this could also be incorporated into the system:

    People have talked about fumbling etc, they could make it so it is possible to free-look during the reload Animation (but in a far smaller arc than normally) but if you were to do this it'd increase the chance of your character doing something that either

    A.) makes the process take longer

    B.) Messes up the process entirely (like losing powder and having an underpowered shot, dropping the percussion Cap and the Gun not going off when Fired).

    If the above happened, in my system you'd need to re-do stage 3 (put the Cap on again). Freelook might be a bit of a stretch though, I imagine the Reload process would probably require full concentration and as Murray says, the interim time between stages is when you'd look around.


    With the systems in place the reward for those who just stand there and do the full normal Reload process would be a very reduced rate of fouling of Weapon along with the knowledge your Gun will fire every time. The reward for those who use the staggered system competently would be the above plus improved situational awareness along with the ability to just do the extra stages of their Reload elsewhere if enemies came near.



    *Also, if you've voted as having your own ideas on this, by all means put your own concept/idea down in this thread.
    Last edited by R21; 10-14-2017 at 12:17 AM.

  2. #42

    USA 1st Lieutenant

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    There's a difference between "realistic" and "real." War of Rights is looking to provide a realistic game, not a real battlefield.

    In a real battlefield, there are any number of reasons my gun might not work- wet powder, fouling, not aiming, double loading- all of which would be major annoyances in a realistic game. Why? Because I'm not fighting a real war. I expect a fun experience when I play a game, not random (or seemingly random) events that keep me from doing what I want to.

    Additionally, there's the development load to consider. Something like this will require a substantial reworking of the animation and reloading systems, time which could probably be better spent on other aspects of development- say, for example, melee.

    Best,
    Dman979

  3. #43

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    WoR is a game that i really like to play for the simple reason that it is a game where you have to work together as a team rather than run and gun till you win. But it is still a game and not RL and why for the love of the gods do you want to make reloading a chore.

    Ps: pls do not give me the BS reason of it ads to the realistic game play. Pressing more that one button to reload is not doing anything other than frustrate players.
    Last edited by MadWolf; 10-14-2017 at 06:05 PM.

  4. #44

    USA Lieutenant Colonel

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    It's not so much about realism as it is playability, by about the 8 second mark in the current reload system I think people start finding it a bit tedious (especially after repeatedly doing it). My system would quite literally break up the mundanity .

    As much as I love the fact they've implemented proper Reloads I think they need this breaking up (even if we don't get 3 stages, maybe just 2). I'm still not entirely sold on random fumbling mistakes, but i'm pretty sure it could be done in a way that there was a degree of control over and in contexts that made sense (like your characters gun being fouled and he himself being injured) making it more likely for some kind of mistake to happen or the Reload take longer).
    Last edited by R21; 10-15-2017 at 03:27 AM.

  5. #45

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    Quote Originally Posted by R21 View Post
    It's not so much about realism as it is playability, by about the 8 second mark in the current reload system I think people start finding it a bit tedious (especially after repeatedly doing it). My system would quite literally break up the mundanity .
    Into... stale, irksome monotony? As you said, people will find any repeated action tedious after a while. Increasing the amount of button-presses needed will only shorten the time to make reloading feel colorless.

    All in all, reloading is going to be a slow part of the game. It's going to take time to reload, it's going to annoy some people, and it's going to try players' patience no matter what. It's simply one of the flaws in making a Civil War game in a Shoot-em-up market, and no amount of interactive button pushing will change the fact that preparing to shoot your gun takes 20 seconds.

    Best,
    Dman979
    Last edited by Dman979; 10-15-2017 at 04:23 AM.

  6. #46

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dman979 View Post
    Into... stale, irksome monotony?
    No, into choice.

    i'll use RO2 and Manual bolting as an example:



    (I didn't make this video, and it's kind of crap)

    people play more slowly and take less shots with Manual Bolting enabled (and it's an extra click of LMB to get your character to do it but i've never seen anyone on their Forums describe it as a QTE or Button bashing) but overall they tend to play better. The ability to choose the time when to do this actually helps players and the complaints came (as they are here with the Full reload) about your character doing something (bolting) which they had no control over. In RO2 (without it enabled) bolting was an uncontrollable action that your character did straight after firing that took say 1-1.5 seconds, this is literally x15 or so in WOR with the current Reload.

    Manual Bolting is left as optional to the Player, but in-Game you can't have the systems standing side by side. In WOR you'd be able to have this, both a non-segmented 'Normal' Reload and the Segmented Reload side by side, so if you really hated the system that much you could totally ignore it by just holding R to do the full uninterrupted Reload.

    I realise WOR is breaking new ground (can't really think of any other Games where pretty much every Unit has such a long Reload process) and I feel a staggered/segmented Reload process might be part of this evolution. If done right, it'd be a really good feature that added to the Game, that's my honest opinion on it.




    Quote Originally Posted by Dman979 View Post

    As you said, people will find any repeated action tedious after a while.
    It's already found to be slightly tedious, and I stand by what I said about my system breaking up the mundanity

  7. #47
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    So your defense for manual bolting, and thus reloading QTEs for WoR, is basically just an oversighted abusable glitch?

    What a good thing to back your point up with. If I was a game dev, I would rather stop selling my game completely than add something as pointless as a reloading QTE.
    http://i.imgur.com/STUHVb8.png

  8. #48

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    Could you be a bit more courteous in your responses please David, it's like you're being flippant and negative just for the sake of being so with some.

    Manual Bolting:

    Really small feature that adds to the Game immensley was actually my point. There are loads of Riflemen on both sides in servers and in WOR pretty much every class is going to be using a similar Weapon with a similar mechanism and Reload time.

  9. #49
    not sure how to vote on this, but i like the 3 segments of reloading

  10. #50
    I've already voiced my opinions, and I don't think anyone can actually change his opinion which is fine, he is standing by his suggestion and it's good. People just don't think (myself included) that adding a button clicking reloading system will actually help with the reloading monotony, it is annoying and boring and it's not supposed to nor does it have to be entertaining, reloading is just a boring thing all around. And as it was said earlier, this game is a realistic game, not a real-life simulator game, if I wanted that I'd do reenacting. Adding in the possibilty of jamming multiple rounds in or something like that. And people regularly won't waste ammo because they are waiting for orders or know the reloading is tedious as all hell. I guarantee you if you add a system like this, people are gonna just get frustrated over and over and the system will become a hated thing because it takes monotony that is pretty bearable, and turns it into simple looking 3 button system, but something that can mess up your rifle like character injuring fouling or something. That's just NOT fun.

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