Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 15

Thread: Targeting of distant figures

  1. #1

    Targeting of distant figures

    Quote Originally Posted by TrustyJam View Post
    October 28th - Update 82 Released!

    - Experimental feature to reduce CPU load on both clients and servers by delaying the update of distant players by X amount of frames based on their distance to the client.

    - Trusty
    Probably just an obvious quick question concerning what I assume is a result of the experimental feature for reducing CPU load. I was playing as Union last night and particularly on Hooker's Push could see the CSA approaching from a fair distance. They had a markedly stuttering appearance at long range, disappearing in and out of view. As a number of us had Spencer rifles we did take some pot-shots but I don't know if anyone was hit. I was curious as to whether the 'stuttering' effect is purely a graphics workaround and assume that if you can lead the target correctly, it is capable of being hit at those longer ranges even if you can't actually see it?

    Of course, I'm flattering myself that I can hit anything beyond 20 paces. Which I can't.

  2. #2

    CSA Captain


    Join Date
    Oct 2017
    Location
    The Netherlands
    Posts
    52
    Not sure that would explain it. It could, but only if the interpolation doesn't use a Lerp to transition between positions. Which it probably does as it is the standard practice. But I could be wrong, as the stuttering could be kind of smooth, just in chunks and then moving really fast. If the smoothing variable on the Lerp function is also set to become faster as the player if farther away from the client you could end up with a stuttering movement as described.

    Normal interpolation: every frame the new position is determined and the movement between the cold and new position is done through a Lerp formula (which makes the transition smooth instead of at once).

    Sped up Lerp interpolation: every couple of frames a new position is determined, to avoid making the transition look weird the Lerp is increased to compensate. Result would be a stuttering player which stands still, then moves abnormally fast, stands still again, loop.

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by JohnDewitt View Post
    Not sure that would explain it. It could, but only if the interpolation doesn't use a Lerp to transition between positions. Which it probably does as it is the standard practice. But I could be wrong, as the stuttering could be kind of smooth, just in chunks and then moving really fast. If the smoothing variable on the Lerp function is also set to become faster as the player if farther away from the client you could end up with a stuttering movement as described.

    Normal interpolation: every frame the new position is determined and the movement between the cold and new position is done through a Lerp formula (which makes the transition smooth instead of at once).

    Sped up Lerp interpolation: every couple of frames a new position is determined, to avoid making the transition look weird the Lerp is increased to compensate. Result would be a stuttering player which stands still, then moves abnormally fast, stands still again, loop.
    I think I understand. Either with or without the Lerp, presumably there is a point at which the target would disappear and then reappear after the new position is determined. Would I be right in guessing this would normally be too quick to interfere with the ballistic calculation for travel of the bullet in terms of targeting, which is presumably handled server-side, regardless of range, or is there actually a period at the longer ranges at which I have noticed the 'stutter' effect, in which it would be possible to miss because the target is transitioning to the new position?

    I will admit that this is not something I would normally be interested in but it has piqued my intellectual curiosity. The simpleton in me would have been happy with "thunderstick not see bad man so no kill."

  4. #4
    The update loop of players does a lot of things. One of those things is updating their position. We are yet to determine if lerping/interpolating the players every frame is that costly (I assume its not) and may in a future either make the lerping update every frame or just increase the distance at which delaying of the updates starts to trigger (so its less likely players will notice it as players will first start to teleport, farther away).

    Ultimately whether or not you hit another player, depends on the server. If the server is running crazy slow due to a high player count, you will have to hit the player at the position he is at, during one of the servers update loops. So technically for you, if the server is running crazy slow, even though for 0,2 seconds, the player appears to be moving on your screen. The player may technically be standing still on the server. That means that in order to hit the player, you will need to hit him at the point he is currently at, or more likely, the point he is at during the next update loop of the server. But with that said, we recently discovered a way to dramatically improve the performance of the server which makes a slow updating server less likely, though we are still to see what exactly happens when theres 80 players on a server with this new improvement.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Fancy Sweetroll View Post
    The update loop of players does a lot of things. One of those things is updating their position. We are yet to determine if lerping/interpolating the players every frame is that costly (I assume its not) and may in a future either make the lerping update every frame or just increase the distance at which delaying of the updates starts to trigger (so its less likely players will notice it as players will first start to teleport, farther away).

    Ultimately whether or not you hit another player, depends on the server. If the server is running crazy slow due to a high player count, you will have to hit the player at the position he is at, during one of the servers update loops. So technically for you, if the server is running crazy slow, even though for 0,2 seconds, the player appears to be moving on your screen. The player may technically be standing still on the server. That means that in order to hit the player, you will need to hit him at the point he is currently at, or more likely, the point he is at during the next update loop of the server. But with that said, we recently discovered a way to dramatically improve the performance of the server which makes a slow updating server less likely, though we are still to see what exactly happens when theres 80 players on a server with this new improvement.
    Huzzah! An official explanation of why my game marksmanship is so poor!

    Thanks both for taking the time to explain.

  6. #6

    CSA Major General

    Dether's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2017
    Location
    Alabama
    Posts
    104
    Quote Originally Posted by Fancy Sweetroll View Post
    The update loop of players does a lot of things. One of those things is updating their position. We are yet to determine if lerping/interpolating the players every frame is that costly (I assume its not) and may in a future either make the lerping update every frame or just increase the distance at which delaying of the updates starts to trigger (so its less likely players will notice it as players will first start to teleport, farther away).

    Ultimately whether or not you hit another player, depends on the server. If the server is running crazy slow due to a high player count, you will have to hit the player at the position he is at, during one of the servers update loops. So technically for you, if the server is running crazy slow, even though for 0,2 seconds, the player appears to be moving on your screen. The player may technically be standing still on the server. That means that in order to hit the player, you will need to hit him at the point he is currently at, or more likely, the point he is at during the next update loop of the server. But with that said, we recently discovered a way to dramatically improve the performance of the server which makes a slow updating server less likely, though we are still to see what exactly happens when theres 80 players on a server with this new improvement.
    for your information.. last night I saw a fed aiming at me and I stepped behind a tee and dropped to a knee.. I could barely make him out at a distance of say 75 to 100.. yet he killed me.. he never moved and shot and killed me.. is this part of what you are speaking of?
    All governments, everywhere derived its power by the consent of the people. The government you have is by your own consent. Not by those brave grey dead of one hundred and fifty plus years ago.

  7. #7
    WoR-Dev TrustyJam's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Denmark
    Posts
    3,554
    Quote Originally Posted by Dether View Post
    for your information.. last night I saw a fed aiming at me and I stepped behind a tee and dropped to a knee.. I could barely make him out at a distance of say 75 to 100.. yet he killed me.. he never moved and shot and killed me.. is this part of what you are speaking of?
    No, while players in the distance are being updated slower for you than people right next to you we are still talking update times of many times a second (unless you run the game with 1 FPS).

    - Trusty

  8. #8

    CSA Major General

    Dether's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2017
    Location
    Alabama
    Posts
    104
    Quote Originally Posted by TrustyJam View Post
    No, while players in the distance are being updated slower for you than people right next to you we are still talking update times of many times a second (unless you run the game with 1 FPS).

    - Trusty
    ok ..so I have to be faster than what I see... I can deal with that for now
    All governments, everywhere derived its power by the consent of the people. The government you have is by your own consent. Not by those brave grey dead of one hundred and fifty plus years ago.

  9. #9
    WoR-Dev TrustyJam's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Denmark
    Posts
    3,554
    Quote Originally Posted by Dether View Post
    ok ..so I have to be faster than what I see... I can deal with that for now
    Huh?

    No, what I was saying was it can't have been the stationary guy killing you (if you were in cover) as he updates lots of times each second for you, even at a distance.

    - Trusty

  10. #10

    CSA Major General

    Dether's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2017
    Location
    Alabama
    Posts
    104
    Quote Originally Posted by TrustyJam View Post
    Huh?

    No, what I was saying was it can't have been the stationary guy killing you (if you were in cover) as he updates lots of times each second for you, even at a distance.

    - Trusty
    now I am confused... he was the only one I could see .. and shot! I saw his smoke as I died. however I could have missed someone,, but I doubt it being that big a coincidence.
    Last edited by Dether; 11-09-2017 at 02:56 AM.
    All governments, everywhere derived its power by the consent of the people. The government you have is by your own consent. Not by those brave grey dead of one hundred and fifty plus years ago.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •