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TrustyJam
01-12-2013, 06:26 PM
Hello all.

I'm sure you all have your favourite civil war weapons and would like to see them ingame. In this thread you'll be able to let everyone know which ones you'd like to see in WoR and why.

My own all time favourite is the Colt 1851 Navy revolver. :)

- Trusty

Chris Mchayes
02-17-2013, 06:58 PM
british enfield rifle! i love the enfield :P

TrustyJam
02-17-2013, 07:35 PM
Welcome to the forum. :)

Aye, the enfield is a given!

- Trusty

Mjtkd
02-18-2013, 09:50 PM
I also enjoy the Colt 1851 Navy revolver.

Fancy Sweetroll
02-18-2013, 10:21 PM
I'm happy to inform you that we'll soon have some more content to show you regarding that ;)

Mjtkd
02-18-2013, 10:25 PM
I'm happy to inform you that we'll soon have some more content to show you regarding that ;)
I’m happy to inform you that I can’t wait for content regarding that :D

Wolfy
02-28-2013, 10:44 PM
Enfield for me 8) Always loved it for some reasn.

Grey
03-03-2013, 12:13 AM
Oh my dear, how I miss you so.
http://lematcivilwarconfederatepistol.tabuywow.com/friday-best-buy/le-mat-civil-war-confederate-pistol-non-firing-replica.jpeg

SgtPepper
03-03-2013, 09:37 PM
1859 sharps carbine. breechloading, accurate, mobile. 'nuff said. but for an extra: put a scope on it--->BAZAM!

TrustyJam
03-03-2013, 09:41 PM
1859 sharps carbine. breechloading, accurate, mobile. 'nuff said. but for an extra: put a scope on it--->BAZAM!

Can't promise anything about a carbine, but we're working on the rifle: http://www.moddb.com/games/war-of-rights/images/sharps-rifle-m1859

- Trusty

SgtPepper
03-03-2013, 09:42 PM
sa-weeeeeet :)

TrustyJam
03-05-2013, 12:40 AM
Enfield for me 8) Always loved it for some reasn.

Here you go then! http://www.moddb.com/games/war-of-rights/images/pattern-1853-enfield#imagebox

- Trusty

Wolfy
03-09-2013, 10:16 PM
Mother of god.....Thats a sweet weapon there :D

Sgt-Frede
03-10-2013, 02:34 AM
I'm glad you liked it!

TrustyJam
03-17-2013, 09:02 PM
Mr. Frede has been awesome once again!

3738

- Trusty

Wolfy
03-17-2013, 09:10 PM
O.O Mother of god......

Amazing work just amazing.Cant wait to see it textured :)

William
03-19-2013, 11:50 AM
O.O Mother of god......

Amazing work just amazing.Cant wait to see it textured :)



canīt wait aswell i hope we they can show us soon some textures :)

Romulus
03-19-2013, 09:59 PM
Bayonets you have to have the Bayonets function. It is amazing.

William
03-20-2013, 05:57 AM
Bayonets you have to have the Bayonets function. It is amazing.

Do you mean a animation to put on the Bajonets ??

Sparhawk
03-21-2013, 03:35 PM
It's going to emerge at some point anyway.
The Union totally "needs" Gatling guns. It'd be ridiculous to balance against, but probably ludicrous fun.
While the Union did have Gatling guns and they had entered manufacture by Antietam, I'm not sure if there were any present at the battle. I've looked around a bit, finding one article that implied there were Gatling guns on the Unionist side, but nothing concrete.
I'm expecting that it'll just be field guns, but I couldn't live with myself if I didn't mention it.

TrustyJam
03-21-2013, 03:44 PM
It's going to emerge at some point anyway.
The Union totally "needs" Gatling guns. It'd be ridiculous to balance against, but probably ludicrous fun.
While the Union did have Gatling guns and they had entered manufacture by Antietam, I'm not sure if there were any present at the battle. I've looked around a bit, finding one article that implied there were Gatling guns on the Unionist side, but nothing concrete.
I'm expecting that it'll just be field guns, but I couldn't live with myself if I didn't mention it.

"The Gatling gun saw only limited use in the Civil War, (Ben Butler used two around Petersburg and eight on gunboats; Porter acquired one; and Hancock ordered twelve for his I (Veteran) Corps)"

Hancock took command of the first corps at antietam when major general Richardson was mortally wounded in the cornfield just south of bloody lane.

Maybe we will need to implement them some time in the future. But I'd say it's unlikely we will. The weapon saw extremely limited use in the war as stated above. :)

- Trusty

Sparhawk
03-22-2013, 12:22 PM
You can just say that Hancock lost them in supply. It's an easy thing to do.
I heard some guy once lost one hundred Baneblades.

TrustyJam
03-22-2013, 02:03 PM
Here's an ingame render of our Springfield 1861!

48

- Trusty

Chris Mchayes
03-22-2013, 03:28 PM
beautiful! :o

Said
03-27-2013, 09:00 PM
i say hail to the gatling gun :D
in my opinion losing a bit of reality to add more fun is not bad .

Wolfy
03-27-2013, 09:18 PM
Well if your aimming for realism then assing gatling guns seems......Just werid and they would most likely OP.

Said
03-27-2013, 09:27 PM
Well if your aimming for realism then assing gatling guns seems......Just werid and they would most likely OP.

not with a bad setup time , recoil , aim and stuff like that
it could be balanced

Chris Mchayes
03-27-2013, 10:19 PM
slow reload, bad aiming , sounds good. lol

TrustyJam
03-27-2013, 10:22 PM
As I said earlier, it is highly unlikely that we'll feature it due to its extremely limited use in the war.

- Trusty

William
03-28-2013, 05:47 AM
i say hail to the gatling gun :D
in my opinion losing a bit of reality to add more fun is not bad .

A gatling gun is awsome but shit in a game because it would be to mutch op

in a LB you aim at a line 10 sec later every one is dead.
Thas op

Wolfy
03-28-2013, 07:30 AM
Indeed,even with slow reload time and bad aiming i feel that the ability to shoot that many rounds so fast while other people have muskets is still just OP.Plus as Trusty said they where not uused that much anyway.

Primergy
03-28-2013, 09:54 AM
Well, there's always a way to balance everything.

Gatlings could have the handicap, that they have a bad accuracy on longer ranges, so they have to get closer to be effective, which will makes them vulnerable to skirmishers and sharpshooters.

Soulfly
03-28-2013, 05:31 PM
and the fact that they will be a bullet magnet themselves

TrustyJam
03-29-2013, 10:19 PM
A beauty created by Primergy:

58

- Trusty

SgtPepper
03-30-2013, 01:30 PM
Indeed,even with slow reload time and bad aiming i feel that the ability to shoot that many rounds so fast while other people have muskets is still just OP.Plus as Trusty said they where not uused that much anyway.
since it was magazine fed the reload was fast. there was also the "Coffe Mill" type where you dropped cartiges into a funnel and it never stopped shooting. it wont overheat because of the revolving barrels. op...yep :D but maybe as fixed mg positions like in Red Orchestra or CoD

William
04-02-2013, 01:04 PM
since it was magazine fed the reload was fast. there was also the "Coffe Mill" type where you dropped cartiges into a funnel and it never stopped shooting. it wont overheat because of the revolving barrels. op...yep :D but maybe as fixed mg positions like in Red Orchestra or CoD

yeah Pepper
indeed :D

TrustyJam
04-03-2013, 08:48 PM
Bit of an odd one here gents! It's a Pepper-box, the forerunner of the revolver. Created by Stefan. :)

62

- Trusty

SgtPepper
04-03-2013, 09:20 PM
pepper box? sounds like it was made for me :D

William
04-08-2013, 06:01 AM
hmm where is the william box ??!! -.-
XD

Soulfly
04-20-2013, 03:57 PM
Just a little idea or something like that...will it be possible to pause or interrupt the reloading of a rifle ?

TrustyJam
05-29-2013, 11:54 PM
Here's the low poly version of the Whitworth rifle used by CSA sharpshooters and imported from Britain. It's been created by Sgt-Frede:

92

- Trusty

William
06-04-2013, 01:18 PM
nice Trusty i hope i will see more of that ^^

95th_Mrks_Fredrick
07-22-2013, 09:34 AM
has the spencer rifle,remington single action revolver,smith and wessen tip up revolver,all these weapons where all used in the civil war as i know

[RG]Chewie
07-22-2013, 05:19 PM
Model 1861 3 Inch Ordnance rifled muzzloader
http://antietam.aotw.org/weapons.php?weapon_id=3

William
07-25-2013, 07:02 AM
more pls ^^

Stefan
07-25-2013, 04:23 PM
No problem!

http://img198.imageshack.us/img198/5862/nekc.jpg

TrustyJam
07-25-2013, 04:45 PM
No problem!

http://img198.imageshack.us/img198/5862/nekc.jpg

LOL! Silly frenchman.

- Trusty

LeRoyOFinny
07-26-2013, 04:08 AM
The Spencer Carbine (My IRL Name)

TrustyJam
07-27-2013, 08:53 AM
The Spencer Carbine (My IRL Name)

We'll prolly look into something like that. Welcome to the forum btw. :)

- Trusty

LeRoyOFinny
07-31-2013, 05:24 AM
Thanks, Glad To Be Here.

BloodBeag
08-02-2013, 02:17 PM
Wait, did they have percussion caps then?

TrustyJam
08-02-2013, 09:30 PM
Wait, did they have percussion caps then?

Indeed they did.

- Trusty

Topper
09-30-2013, 10:30 AM
http://www.google.dk/imgres?imgurl=http://relicman.com/weapons/imageweapon/W1008A.JPG&imgrefurl=http://relicman.com/weapons/zArchiveWeaponMusketModel1841Whitney.htm&h=450&w=1231&sz=39&tbnid=z6Bz7A6E-BtL0M:&tbnh=52&tbnw=142&zoom=1&usg=__cqkVmp7_a7dYwrh2rfJRrhNCVgY=&docid=UvZZr6Vy8alegM&hl=da&sa=X&ei=YURJUt_GCajJ4ATb84CYCQ&ved=0CEIQ9QEwBA
Mississippi Rifle 1841 mod. Whitney
Thats a cool rifle with a nice attachment :D

Louisiana_Tiger
12-19-2015, 08:49 AM
I think that including a fully functioning ( the shotgun portion) Lemat would be an amazing weapon to include in the game if it hasnt already been added.

TrustyJam
12-19-2015, 08:57 AM
I think that including a fully functioning ( the shotgun portion) Lemat would be an amazing weapon to include in the game if it hasnt already been added.

Pretty cool weapon, yeah. :)

- Trusty

Johnnyboy
12-19-2015, 10:31 AM
Bit of an odd one here gents! It's a Pepper-box, the forerunner of the revolver. Created by Stefan. :)

62

- Trusty

I heard that the pepperbox used to blow up in the users face after constant use? would you know if that's true?

Mississippi
12-19-2015, 11:46 AM
Will there be a flintlock Rifle and or a flintlock pistol for the Confederate side?

Maximus Decimus Meridius
12-19-2015, 12:30 PM
Will there be a flintlock Rifle and or a flintlock pistol for the Confederate side?

With less accuracy of course. but that would be unbalancing the battle.

Hinkel
12-19-2015, 12:32 PM
With less accuracy of course. but that would be unbalancing the battle.

There will be unbalanced situations in the game.
Just take the Sunken Road advance as an example.

While the confederates used rifled muskets to defend the road, the Irish Brigade advanced with their Smoothbore muskets, which are inaccurate as hell. They have to get close to 40 yards, to hit anything.

You have to deal with those situations and do your best ;)

A. P. Hill
12-19-2015, 12:36 PM
Unbalanced was realistic in the real ACW. ;)

Usually unbalanced in favor of the Union.

Maximus Decimus Meridius
12-19-2015, 12:49 PM
There will be unbalanced situations in the game.
Just take the Sunken Road advance as an example.

While the confederates used rifled muskets to defend the road, the Irish Brigade advanced with their Smoothbore muskets, which are inaccurate as hell. They have to get close to 40 yards, to hit anything.

You have to deal with those situations and do your best ;)

from the historical side it's sound very great (my side) but from the otterside ( :p ) it will hit the gameplay I think. these unbalanced situations should be sprout similar to both sides to avoid that some players flame about a specific side and say " they only win because they have better weapons)

FirstDiv2Corps
12-19-2015, 08:39 PM
For those who wanted to be ultra-authentic, it should be fairly easy to find ordnance reports from either army to see what individual units were armed with.

As an example, this is for the Battle of Fredericksburg, but you get the idea:

Co. Regiment No. Armament
A 63rd N.Y. Infantry 1 Springfield Rifled Muskets, model 1855, 1861, N.A. and contract. Calibre .58
18 Smooth-bored Muskets, model 1842. Calibre .69
B 63rd N.Y. Infantry 1 Springfield Rifled Muskets, model 1855, 1861, N.A. and contract. Calibre .58
10 Smooth-bored Muskets, model 1842. Calibre .69
C 63rd N.Y. Infantry 13 Smooth-bored Muskets, model 1842. Calibre .69
D 63rd N.Y. Infantry 2 Enfield Rifled Muskets. Calibre .58 and .577
12 Smooth-bored Muskets, model 1842. Calibre .69
E 63rd N.Y. Infantry 1 Springfield Rifled Muskets, model 1855, 1861, N.A. and contract. Calibre .58
14 Smooth-bored Muskets, model 1842. Calibre .69
F 63rd N.Y. Infantry 3 Springfield Rifled Muskets, model 1855, 1861, N.A. and contract. Calibre .58
13 Smooth-bored Muskets, model 1842. Calibre .69
G 63rd N.Y. Infantry 1 Enfield Rifled Muskets. Calibre .58 and .577
19 Smooth-bored Muskets, model 1842. Calibre .69
H 63rd N.Y. Infantry 1 Enfield Rifled Muskets. Calibre .58 and .577
13 Smooth-bored Muskets, model 1842. Calibre .69
I 63rd N.Y. Infantry 7 Smooth-bored Muskets, model 1842. Calibre .69
K 63rd N.Y. Infantry 1 Enfield Rifled Muskets, Calibre .58 and .577
14 Smooth-bored Muskets, model 1842. Calibre .69

SpectretheGreat
12-20-2015, 02:31 AM
I like how there will be situations that are un-balanced by default, however if that is the case then we should have a hyper-realistic game instead of a here and there type like battlefield. Either %110 or not at all.

JaegerCoyote
12-20-2015, 05:28 AM
A interesting thing I discovered when looking at the battle, there was a Pennsylvania regiment armed with rifled 1842s. A .69 cal. Minnie ball, that is some serious hurt but that rifle had to have some kick.

Tar Heel
12-22-2015, 03:36 AM
A interesting thing I discovered when looking at the battle, there was a Pennsylvania regiment armed with rifled 1842s. A .69 cal. Minnie ball, that is some serious hurt but that rifle had to have some kick.

There were a small number of rifled 1842s produced before the war. It was later abandoned in favor of the 1855 model (which was replaced by the 1861 model), as the rifled 1842 still fired a round ball and there was only a slight increase in accuracy compared to the '55, which fired a conical bullet like the Minie ball.

Numitor
12-22-2015, 08:30 PM
I love the French 1822 light cavalry saber (http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-fXHvJmfxy_c/T1kphmOOmzI/AAAAAAAADqM/VhVFtpmZDxI/s1600/sabre+fourreau.jpg) and the Prussian 1852 cavalry saber (http://www.coldsteel-uk.com/store/1852-prussian-saber-large.jpg). Both were issued during the American Civil War since the American 1840 and 1860 cavalry sabers weren't available in sufficient quantities.

MrAmerican
12-22-2015, 08:47 PM
A beauty created by Primergy:

58

- Trusty

my god this is magnificent

A. P. Hill
12-22-2015, 10:14 PM
my god this is magnificent

I think it's not as pretty as it could be .. :)

Mississippi
12-22-2015, 10:18 PM
my god this is magnificent

Looks awesome!

Hinkel
12-22-2015, 10:25 PM
The 12lb Napoleon is a very old model. Be prepared for some updated guns next year :)

C.S.A. Sniper43
01-08-2016, 04:21 AM
how about the lemat revolver 9 rnds with a 20ga under the barrel

rebeldestroyer
01-08-2016, 04:23 AM
Dear god I hope they put the lemat in

JaegerCoyote
01-08-2016, 04:29 AM
I would love to see the Lorenz in the game, that rifle was a favorite on NaS.

R21
01-09-2016, 10:08 PM
I like how there will be situations that are un-balanced by default, however if that is the case then we should have a hyper-realistic game instead of a here and there type like battlefield. Either %110 or not at all.

I've played numerous realism focused Games over the years and it always comes back to Gameplay > Realism.

Better to have concessions made based around user feedback and maintain player numbers rather than make something that's so heavily realism focused it gets played by like 10 people 6 months after release.

SemajRednaxela
01-09-2016, 11:33 PM
Whitworth please.

Patrick Kurtz
01-10-2016, 12:04 AM
Spencer Repeater, just because I once read where a small force of cavalry held off a separate force of 4x their size due to the fact that they had repeaters. (I know this is only cavalry though )

WhiskyHotel3
01-10-2016, 03:53 AM
Napoleonic Baker Rifle

Maybe it can be more accurate but longer to reload cus its powder not cap?>

Maximus Decimus Meridius
01-10-2016, 02:00 PM
Napoleonic Baker Rifle



I can see Major Richard Sharpe and Sergeant Harper fighting against the rebels at Antietam. ;D

BloodBeag
01-10-2016, 02:10 PM
I can see Major Richard Sharpe and Sergeant Harper fighting against the rebels at Antietam. ;D

And as it is Sharpe there is a evil or useless christian because it's written by Bernard Cornwell and he had some kind of christian step-daddy issue

SemajRednaxela
01-10-2016, 05:18 PM
According to the Civil war books Cornwell wrote, Sharpes son (Patric Lassan) was involved in the civil war as a French cavalry officer.

And as to the fire rate of the British Infantry Rifle. Which is never called a Baker Rifle! The rate of fire would differ depending on whether the loader was using patched ball and horn or just cartridges. That and the firing animations would have to be different as the rifle is primed first. Unlike the precession caps of the era which were place on the nipped last.

Hawke262
01-11-2016, 10:18 AM
Any chance of the Henry Rifle making an appearance?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henry_rifle

Hinkel
01-11-2016, 11:08 AM
Any chance of the Henry Rifle making an appearance?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henry_rifle

Short answer: Of course! ;)
If a gun was used during the Maryland Campaign (rifles, short arms, sabres, cannons) you can be sure, it will be ingame one day.

Hawke262
01-11-2016, 11:10 AM
Awesome! Thanks.

rebeldestroyer
01-11-2016, 03:39 PM
Short answer: Of course!
If a gun was used during the Maryland Campaign (rifles, short arms, sabres, cannons) you can be sure, it will be ingame one day.
#OP

SHoGUN
01-12-2016, 04:35 AM
Looking forward to using sabres. I hope they are in game and issued to Officers. Keen on that sabre charge

JaegerCoyote
01-12-2016, 05:58 AM
Sabers were also still used by cav.

William Bowen
01-12-2016, 06:44 AM
My personal favorite is the Springfield 1861. I also like the colt Navy. I imagine both will be in the game.

TrustyJam
01-12-2016, 06:21 PM
My personal favorite is the Springfield 1861. I also like the colt Navy. I imagine both will be in the game.

Both were featured in the Kickstarter trailer. :)

- Trusty

SemajRednaxela
01-12-2016, 07:40 PM
Has it been mentioned if you can pick up weapons from corpses in game???

Afterall, they don't need them anymore.

R21
01-13-2016, 09:47 AM
I know it's un-popular with the Realism crowd, but Gatling Guns.

They'd be balanced by the fact they'd have a limited arc of fire and would be really slow to reload. If ever they implement the Generals idea for a Campaign mode it'd be an awesome unlock for higher level Generals (like you got to deploy 1 after reaching a certain rank and any Stat bonuses you'd accrued would be removed, making the General choose between stat buffs or 1 Gatling Gun) this way they'd be very limited.

The Pepper-box is also an interesting choice, i'm hoping they can malfunction and fire all Barrels at once as it'd actually wind up being useful lol.

Hinkel
01-13-2016, 09:56 AM
I know it's un-popular with the Realism crowd, but Gatling Guns.
.

Please listen to this part ;)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z5snMNkXdoo&feature=youtu.be&t=410

Short: It was not used during the Maryland Campaign and won't be included at all.

SemajRednaxela
01-13-2016, 01:57 PM
I can't for the life of me understand why so many people want a galling gun in game...

Hussay for Hinkel finally putting this issue to bed!

Willie Fisterbottom
01-13-2016, 02:03 PM
I can't for the life of me understand why so many people want a galling gun in game...

Hussay for Hinkel finally putting this issue to bed!

Because it sounds fun to mow down people that are helpless against you.

Maximus Decimus Meridius
01-13-2016, 02:08 PM
Because it sounds fun to mow down people that are helpless against you.

Why do you want this feeling?

Because you know that they would rek you if you dont have this weapon ;)


This weapon would be the most hated weapon ingame

Soulfly
01-13-2016, 02:12 PM
He, who played Shogun 2: Fall of the Samurai, knows the feeling to well. But i cant see any point adding such OP weapons

Maximus Decimus Meridius
01-13-2016, 02:42 PM
He, who played Shogun 2: Fall of the Samurai, knows the feeling to well. But i cant see any point adding such OP weapons

I think so, too.

But there are more points which speaks against the gatling gun.

1. not historical correct.
2. A little bit OP
3. A lot would want to play this weapon and the half of artillary would be a gatling to win the battles against everything in close combat.

R21
01-14-2016, 12:13 AM
I don't think they'd be OP if they were implemented in the way I described, they'd add a bit of randomness and variety to Campaign Battles:

If you read back what I wrote ::

1 in an entire Campaign only available to Generals that had unlocked it at the sacrifice of any Army stat Buffs that general had received.

Limited arc of fire along with slow Reload time : They'd be a highly situational Weapon mainly useful for area denial, if you got out maneuvered their usefulness would quickly be negated.

I think even the realism enthusiasts will eventually get bored of playing the same battles over and over, small random elements like this would make it so Game-play was more varied.

Johnnyboy
01-14-2016, 12:20 AM
I don't think they'd be OP if they were implemented in the way I described, they'd add a bit of randomness and variety to Campaign Battles:

If you read back what I wrote ::

1 in an entire Campaign only available to Generals that had unlocked it at the sacrifice of any Army stat Buffs that general had received.

Limited arc of fire along with slow Reload time : They'd be a highly situational Weapon mainly useful for area denial, if you got out maneuvered their usefulness would quickly be negated.

I think even the realism enthusiasts will eventually get bored of playing the same battles over and over, small random elements like this would make it so Game-play was more varied.

As Hinkel has stated, they WERE NOT used during the Maryland Campaign of 1862.

R21
01-14-2016, 12:28 AM
I don't think they should completely dismiss the idea, I can understand them not putting it in the initial release but they'd be missing a trick not putting it in some time down the line.

If they want the Game to remain successful and be played for years by a good Player-base (especially once it hits Steam) they should think about including it in a DLC Campaign or something, I think there's enough leeway in terms of Historic accuracy for them to be included in limited Numbers:


A couple Union officers bought a few the guns privately, so the guns did see very limited action during the war. The most notable purchase was by General Benjamin F. Butler, who bought twelve guns at $1,000 each. Two of those guns were used at Petersburg in 1864 to defend against Confederate attacks, and the guns worked quite well.

That basically ties into my idea of them being a high level unlock for High level Generals to be deployed in limited numbers.

SemajRednaxela
01-14-2016, 12:35 AM
Why do you want this feeling?

Because you know that they would rek you if you dont have this weapon ;)


This weapon would be the most hated weapon ingame

Well said Sir.

SHoGUN
01-14-2016, 05:24 AM
Will the Henry Rifle be in game at all? If so, I'm guessing it would have to be extremely limited, so how would limitations be applied? I've seen mention of the Henry Rifle, but not a lot of discussion on it.

-edit-

Found some info on it it the book: 'The American Civil War: A Handbook of Literature and Research' on page 392. Seems that use of the rifle kicked in after the Maryland Campaign, so I'm guessing when there are more campaigns added, we may see this additional weapon.

FirstDiv2Corps
01-14-2016, 05:46 AM
Will the Henry Rifle be in game at all? If so, I'm guessing it would have to be extremely limited, so how would limitations be applied? I've seen mention of the Henry Rifle, but not a lot of discussion on it.

-edit-

Found some info on it it the book: 'The American Civil War: A Handbook of Literature and Research' on page 392. Seems that use of the rifle kicked in after the Maryland Campaign, so I'm guessing when there are more campaigns added, we may see this additional weapon.

Same story with the Spencer Carbine.

Maximus Decimus Meridius
01-14-2016, 12:16 PM
I read in a thread that the Henry rifle will be available

JaegerCoyote
01-16-2016, 08:18 AM
With the report that all weapons that were in Maryland campaign will be in the game, I want to see the 6th PA's lances.

A. P. Hill
01-17-2016, 08:21 PM
Here's a fine list of weapons and who used them during Antietam (http://antietam.aotw.org/weapons.php?weapon_id=all)

BloodBeag
01-17-2016, 08:30 PM
Here's a fine list of weapons and who used them during Antietam (http://antietam.aotw.org/weapons.php?weapon_id=all)

i read that company A and B of the 14th Connecticut had Sharp's rifles but that website says otherwise

JaegerCoyote
01-18-2016, 12:22 AM
The weapon page has a error, they were issued them.

FirstDiv2Corps
01-18-2016, 06:47 AM
That list also isn't in absolutes. It's in general terms, saying which weapons were on the field, but not listing every unit that used which.

Colonel P. R. Page
01-25-2016, 02:53 AM
Hello all.

I'm sure you all have your favourite civil war weapons and would like to see them ingame. In this thread you'll be able to let everyone know which ones you'd like to see in WoR and why.

My own all time favourite is the Colt 1851 Navy revolver. :)

- Trusty

Bowie Knives?? Please??

stuka
01-25-2016, 04:33 AM
People keep saying the gatling gun and people keep saying slow reload to nerf it, the problem is that is unrealistic.

Another issue is that it wasn't used in the first campaign that is being made thus if we were to see it at all we would need a much better nerfing idea than reload.

My idea would be poor accuracy and limited ammo. You could also just implement it on defensive battles and only one for the union at that point.

1 keeps it so the OPness is severely limited, the ROF makes it an ammo guzzler and the limited ammo makes it so you have to know when to use it or all shots will be wasted or at least not as effectivly used as possible.

While many people see the gatling gun as iconic, this is also a game and if not balanced properly we could have issues with people leaving/rage quitting

Mississippi
01-25-2016, 04:55 AM
1855 Colt Revolving Rifle

Flintlock Rifle

Flintlock Pistol

Willy The Walrus
01-25-2016, 11:27 PM
They had scopes on some sharp rifles and withworth rifles
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xWYdJQGiDFQ <------- Civil war A nation divided Scoped sharps rifle.

A. P. Hill
01-26-2016, 01:06 AM
They had scopes on some sharp rifles and withworth rifles
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xWYdJQGiDFQ <------- Civil war A nation divided Scoped sharps rifle.

Yes, yes they did ... only on specialized units and/or individuals, not entire regiments or brigades, or divisions or corps.

Brooklyn
01-26-2016, 04:13 AM
The Springfield Model 1842 with it's "buck and ball" load.

Hinkel
01-26-2016, 09:26 AM
The Springfield Model 1842 with it's "buck and ball" load.

Hell yeah, definatly used by the Irish Brigade! ;)

Bravescot
01-29-2016, 08:16 AM
Pity they were not in the Maryland Campaign

stuka
01-29-2016, 09:24 AM
Well they aren't going to be only doing the maryland campaign correct?

If they do other campaigns and they find a way to balance the gatling gun then perhaps we may see it.

A. P. Hill
01-29-2016, 01:26 PM
Well they aren't going to be only doing the maryland campaign correct?

If they do other campaigns and they find a way to balance the gatling gun then perhaps we may see it.

As War of Rights and the development team have stated time and again, everything produced will be as historically accurate as possible. That means we will not be putting equipment into any and all future additions to this series, unless they were actually in use.

There is nothing to be gained by alternative history and then nerfing the equipment.

Very very few battles of the ACW ever saw Gatling guns in action. I am not saying they didn't exist, I saying they were not used in massive quantity.

Sorry, the Gatling isn't going to show any time soon.

FirstGod
01-29-2016, 02:37 PM
The Henry Rifle. :P

Deven
01-29-2016, 08:21 PM
The Starr DA :p

55thNY Col J-Man11
01-30-2016, 02:23 AM
A couple of weapons that could be used in the game:

Springfield Model 1847 (Musketoon)
Henry rifle
Spencer repeating rifle
Pattern 1853 Enfield

[RG]Chewie
01-30-2016, 04:11 AM
can i drown someone in a puddle in hand to hand?

Price
01-31-2016, 09:15 AM
A blunderbuss

crazychester1247
02-22-2016, 02:10 PM
Can you please add in the 1848 Colt Dragoon revolver, their were 20,000 units sold. and don't forget the Baby Dragoon, I almost did.
231823192320
and as a way to balance the game for cavalry units who get all their firepower from pistols I recomend letting cavalrymen carry two revolvers into battle. It's historically accurate and as long as we can't dual wield it's balanced.

Also don't let anyone dual wield it's completely unrealistic.

Le_Fossoyeur
02-25-2016, 09:17 AM
Belgian Made musket ;)

http://www.collegehillarsenal.com/shop/product.php?productid=799
http://civilwartalk.com/threads/belgian-musket.21939/

Brooklyn
03-01-2016, 05:34 PM
Colt Dragoon revolver with shoulder stock.
2370

Hartl
03-01-2016, 05:49 PM
Richmond 1862, Type III

A. P. Hill
03-01-2016, 05:57 PM
Chewie;21510']can i drown someone in a puddle in hand to hand?

I drowned myself the other day. ;)

Skipper
03-02-2016, 04:56 PM
I drowned myself the other day. ;)

Awesoooome :D

Legion
03-02-2016, 08:57 PM
I'm not sure if this has been asked before but seeing as it has to do with weapons I'll post it here.
Will weapons be accurate out to there true ranges? or will you limit there range. For instance the Mississippi Rifle had a maximum firing range of 2000 yards but it only had an effective range of 1100 yards. Theoretically will I be able to hit targets out to 1100 yards or will I be limited? I understand that once the shooting starts our range will be limited by smoke and visibility. Also will our bullets keep traveling out to 2000 yards unless they hit something?
I really hope you keep the ranges as true to life as possible.

A. P. Hill
03-03-2016, 12:40 AM
Awesoooome :D

Oh it was slow and painful too! I was walking along in the water when the bottom dropped out from under me. :) How's that Johnnie Cash song go? I went down down down ... and the water got deeper.

Legion
03-03-2016, 03:50 AM
Oh it was slow and painful too! I was walking along in the water when the bottom dropped out from under me. :) How's that Johnnie Cash song go? I went down down down ... and the water got deeper.

Wait, so you cant swim? Well there goes my dream of becoming a Confederate navy seal. Oh well

crazychester1247
03-03-2016, 04:55 AM
Will we by any chance see tomahawks?

RhettVito
03-03-2016, 06:32 AM
Will we by any chance see tomahawks?

Why would we see that ? Come on man... This is the Civil War not The ''French and Indian War'' . Now if you can find a soldier from the Maryland Campaign or a quartermaster report of them haveing it then yea I gess but I highly doubt any would have it .

crazychester1247
03-03-2016, 08:20 AM
how about bowie knives? and by tomahawk I'm talking about axes in general, I should have clarified.

RhettVito
03-03-2016, 08:58 AM
how about bowie knives? and by tomahawk I'm talking about axes in general, I should have clarified.

bowie knives meh but really man if it was Maryland Campaign and if you can find a original quartermaster report or original pic or account of it then yea but for the most part WoR is going for a more accurate stuff that was alot more used and was there yes some guys had bowie knives but not all of them. But to say back about this there is a very good book on the Civil War called Echoes of Glory check it out its all about the Civil War.

crazychester1247
03-04-2016, 06:54 AM
Can we use flags as weapons? like in the last samurai. You figure they have a heavy piece of metal at the top and you can build up a lot of force swinging them around. Plus it would be awesome to see two flagbearers get in a fight.

and don't even get me started on the spear finals.

R21
03-04-2016, 08:46 PM
+1

https://youtu.be/XCtuZ-fDL2E?t=110

For these.

A. P. Hill
03-04-2016, 11:20 PM
+1

https://youtu.be/XCtuZ-fDL2E?t=110

For these.

No, I don't think we're going to have Samurai in the battle. ;)

Willy The Walrus
03-09-2016, 01:26 AM
fayetteville rifle~ confederate version of springfield

Legion
03-09-2016, 02:04 AM
fayetteville rifle~ confederate version of springfield

That's a backer weapon, you get it if you pledge at a certain tier

JaegerCoyote
03-09-2016, 02:12 AM
fayetteville rifle~ confederate version of springfield

Its in the game as a backer reward

Willy The Walrus
03-09-2016, 01:59 PM
Its in the game as a backer reward

I didn't see thanks!

crazychester1247
03-10-2016, 03:28 AM
Will the famous Arkansas Toothpick make an appearance?
23932394

Cube210
03-28-2016, 09:43 PM
Springfield 1816 flint or converted percussion

Because I like them. Heck I'm buying one. Pretty much the last of the flintlock U.S. Army guns and it has lineage in design back to the Charleville and the 1795. They used them early and throughout the war (hell they used whatever they could get)
Also with the militia act of 1808 I wouldn't doubt many militias and guardsman brought them.

Pennsylvania long rifle.
Reason? It is the Pennsylvania long rifle that is your reason!

Brooklyn
03-29-2016, 01:59 AM
Sharps Breech Loading Percussion Pistol
2603

Hatchmo
03-29-2016, 02:08 AM
Definitely for me the 1853 Enfield. It's what I shoot and it's incredibly accurate.

Beanbomb
03-29-2016, 03:30 AM
this is a brown bess converted to percussion used by a confederate soldier. I think the british wanted to get rid of their outdated muskets and sold some to the CSA.

2604

BloodBeag
03-29-2016, 03:29 PM
I just saw something saying that the confederates used landmines , no joke

crazychester1247
03-29-2016, 03:54 PM
I just saw something saying that the confederates used landmines , no joke

I don't know that much about strange civil war weaponry like this but I can see it. They had sea mines at the time so they obviously had the general idea.

Brooklyn
03-29-2016, 04:35 PM
I just saw something saying that the confederates used landmines , no joke

From what I found they were called torpedoes at the time and were developed by General Gabriel J. Rains and were first used during the Peninsula Campaign in 1862.

Also Sherman who hated the use of "torpedoes" used Confederate POWs to march at the head of his column so that they might trigger any hidden "torpedoes.”

RobertSahlqvist
03-29-2016, 06:47 PM
How about the Henry Rifle.

Locke1740
03-29-2016, 06:54 PM
I just saw something saying that the confederates used landmines , no joke

Yes and Submarines and torpedoes

Isolation
03-29-2016, 07:35 PM
I also enjoy the Colt 1851 Navy revolver.

Beanbomb
03-29-2016, 07:43 PM
I have a question about weapons. Will it be something that the player gets to pick? If so, will I need to unlock later weapons? For example, when a player is just starting out they get weapons like the 1816 musket or the 1842, then after playing for a while they unlock things like the spencer. Because if I can pick between an 1842 springfield or a sharps rifle right at the beginning, I would obviously go for the faster and more accurate gun.

Basically, my question is how will weapons be given to the player?
And the game is looking amazing, keep up the good work!

Brooklyn
03-29-2016, 08:05 PM
I have a question about weapons. Will it be something that the player gets to pick? If so, will I need to unlock later weapons? For example, when a player is just starting out they get weapons like the 1816 musket or the 1842, then after playing for a while they unlock things like the spencer. Because if I can pick between an 1842 springfield or a sharps rifle right at the beginning, I would obviously go for the faster and more accurate gun.

Basically, my question is how will weapons be given to the player?
And the game is looking amazing, keep up the good work!

According to this, Uniforms and weapon availability will depend on which regiment the player selects to join.
https://warofrights.com/KickstarterUpdate4.aspx#navigationContainer

Locke1740
03-29-2016, 08:13 PM
will the Whitworth Rifle be included? As well as the Whitworth cannon?

Beanbomb
03-29-2016, 08:18 PM
According to this, Uniforms and weapon availability will depend on which regiment the player selects to join.
https://warofrights.com/KickstarterUpdate4.aspx#navigationContainer

Thank you very much!

Beanbomb
03-29-2016, 09:06 PM
will the Whitworth Rifle be included? As well as the Whitworth cannon?

I don't know about the cannon, but they have a model for the rifle.

2610

Legion
03-29-2016, 10:53 PM
will the Whitworth Rifle be included? As well as the Whitworth cannon?
Yes, both will be included, most likely for southern units only I would think.

elder_gutknecht
03-30-2016, 09:21 PM
The Whitworth rifle was extremly rare to see and even more with telescopic sight, usually confederates sharpshooters used Enfield two or three band
The Whitworth was a letal long range rifle and i hope they can be used only after a good sniper's reputation

Legion
03-30-2016, 09:38 PM
The Whitworth rifle was extremly rare to see and even more with telescopic sight, usually confederates sharpshooters used Enfield two or three band
The Whitworth was a letal long range rifle and i hope they can be used only after a good sniper's reputation

There are other rifles that have a long range like the whitworth. The Mississippi rifle has an effective range of 1000-1100 yards and a maximum range of around 2000.
I dont think it's gonna be a game changer considering we are gonna be getting killed in one shot most of the time anyways from close range. Most players won't be able to make shots from that kind of distance anyways.

elder_gutknecht
03-30-2016, 10:43 PM
But, did the Misisipi have less accuracy?
Lone long range sharpshooters existed, they'll target officers and arty, and had their role in ACW, of course the only way to hit at this range it's a lot of training, and players could recognize you as a real sniper by your "black eye"

Legion
03-31-2016, 01:49 AM
But, did the Misisipi have less accuracy?
Lone long range sharpshooters existed, they'll target officers and arty, and had their role in ACW, of course the only way to hit at this range it's a lot of training, and players could recognize you as a real sniper by your "black eye"

It wasn't as accurate but it was accurate out to 1100 yards, that's what effective range is. Hitting targets out to 1000 yards isn't extremely hard, it just takes time to set up the shot. And unless players can shoot while prone or can set up there gun and a rest, I doubt they'll be making those long range shots.

Legion
08-08-2016, 04:40 PM
What will yall do about telescopic sights and rifles that were mostly used by sharpshooters? Will only official sharpshooting companies be able to have these weapons and sights?

The reason I as is because alot of brigades hand picked men to be in sharpshooting companies and would activate them when needed but then they weren't needed they would just go back to there unit. For instance the 1st Louisiana Brigade had a company or two (not quite sure how many) of hand picked sharpshooters, will this be represented in-game or will certain weapons/sights only be available for the "official" sharpshooting regiments?

JRob
08-08-2016, 07:07 PM
I would hope to see the spencer carbine or any carbine for cavalry.

crazychester1247
08-08-2016, 08:09 PM
I would hope to see the spencer carbine or any carbine for cavalry.

Once cav releases their is certainly going to be carbines of some nature.

I'd expect the Burnsides carbine, the Sharps Cavalry, the Smith carbine, Gallager carbine, and the Frank Wesson Rifle to make an apperance.

nreilly
08-14-2016, 01:43 AM
If you look at old photographs, you see soldiers with (at least) one extra pistol in the beginning of the war. Later, the soldiers abandoned these heavy sidearms, keeping only the army-issue musket and bayonet. I was wondering if this would be implemented in some form.

There should be a control to swing your rifle like a club in hand to hand combat if your bayonet is not attached. This would be a rare instance for line infantry but in surprise attacks?

Wisner
08-14-2016, 09:12 AM
Spencer Model 1860 Carbine

TrustyJam
08-14-2016, 09:16 AM
Spencer Model 1860 Carbine

It wasn't in use until 1863 as far as I know. At least not in any big numbers. :)

- Trusty

Sanjan_Belir
08-15-2016, 07:46 PM
Musketoons would be fun! (Although they should be well balanced if put in the game, shotguns can have some balancing problems lol)

thomas aagaard
08-15-2016, 08:18 PM
It wasn't in use until 1863 as far as I know. At least not in any big numbers. :)

- Trusty
Correct it was not used until late 63.

Bufords Cavalry at gettysburg did NOT have spencers...

(some other federal cavalry did have the spencer rifle, but they where not under Buford and not involved on day 1)

Hinkel
08-15-2016, 09:24 PM
Correct it was not used until late 63.

Bufords Cavalry at gettysburg did NOT have spencers...

(some other federal cavalry did have the spencer rifle, but they where not under Buford and not involved on day 1)

Bufords Cavalry was equipped like a bunch of rebels :cool:
Armed with Sharps, Burnsides, Merrills, Ballards and Maynards... and not even sabre's :p

A. P. Hill
08-15-2016, 09:54 PM
Bufords Cavalry was equipped like a bunch of rebels :cool:
Armed with Sharps, Burnsides, Merrills, Ballards and Maynards... and not even sabre's :p

That's not so bad, many was the time reb cavalry armed as stated, whipped up on any opposing yankee force. ;)

thomas aagaard
08-15-2016, 10:06 PM
Bufords Cavalry was equipped like a bunch of rebels :cool:
Armed with Sharps, Burnsides, Merrills, Ballards and Maynards... and not even sabre's :p

Exactly... different breach loaded carbines.

But one still find the myth about the repeaters in books from time to time.

Wildcat
08-18-2016, 10:07 AM
What units used Whitworths?

thomas aagaard
08-18-2016, 10:23 AM
no regiments used them exclusively. There where way to few of them for that.
(only a few hundreds was imported, out of less then 14.000 made)

They where used by the CSA sharpshooter battalions, a handfull here and a handfull there.
So Iam wondering how it will be implemented, with so few in use.

Legion
08-18-2016, 12:14 PM
A little over 1000 were imported from what I've read. Imo it won't be any problem, the range at which you can see people in the game is so small that the whitworths advantages are almost none existent.

I would suggest spreading them out among units that had sharpshooters in them, even if they weren't an official sharpshooter battalion. There weren't many sharpshooter battalions from what I know but there were many sharpshooter companies that were handpicked. It would be cool if you did it like they did and only gave it to players who are good shots.

thomas aagaard
08-18-2016, 12:23 PM
Can you recommend any good online article about it?


The obvious question is, how many of them was in use by the ANV by september 62?

Wildcat
08-18-2016, 12:37 PM
I would suggest spreading them out among units that had sharpshooters in them, even if they weren't an official sharpshooter battalion. There weren't many sharpshooter battalions from what I know but there were many sharpshooter companies that were handpicked. It would be cool if you did it like they did and only gave it to players who are good shots.

I like the idea but the only problem would be the fact that *currently* the game doesn't take much skill to shoot. I just read they were also put among normal line infantry units, If any devs are reading how you will implement them?

Nick Lazanis
08-18-2016, 01:15 PM
Why must the Colt 1851 Navy be so incredibly beautiful

Wildcat
08-18-2016, 01:19 PM
Why must the Colt 1851 Navy be so incredibly beautiful

Lefaucheux M1858 is much nicer especially because it isn't a yankee build ;)

quick question to anyone who knows, How much rounds will we be able to carry? Ive read that irl it would of been 40-60 but I also saw someone say 75.

Legion
08-18-2016, 01:39 PM
I like the idea but the only problem would be the fact that *currently* the game doesn't take much skill to shoot. I just read they were also put among normal line infantry units, If any devs are reading how you will implement them?

They weren't used in the line though, they hand picked men from the brigade and put them in a sharpshooter company. Whenever they needed them they would call the company of sharpshooters, if they didn't need them then they would just act like regular line infantry.

Alexander Greene
08-19-2016, 01:49 AM
Lefaucheux M1858 is much nicer especially because it isn't a yankee build ;)

quick question to anyone who knows, How much rounds will we be able to carry? Ive read that irl it would of been 40-60 but I also saw someone say 75.

In real life, the round count would have been 40. The soldiers on both sides nicknamed their cartridge boxes "Forty dead men" because the minie ball and the rifled musket made for a very scary combination as could be seen on a battlefield in it's aftermath.

JaegerCoyote
08-19-2016, 11:28 AM
40-60 seemed to be the range. Also the Colt Pocket is sexy.

Wildcat
08-19-2016, 02:46 PM
40-60 seemed to be the range. Also the Colt Pocket is sexy.

Lefaucheux, Kerr's Patent Revolver and Beaumont–Adams revolver are the best looking lets be honest.

also thanks Alexander and Jaeger :D

TooL
08-22-2016, 05:59 PM
Springfield 1816 flint or converted percussion

Because I like them. Heck I'm buying one. Pretty much the last of the flintlock U.S. Army guns and it has lineage in design back to the Charleville and the 1795. They used them early and throughout the war (hell they used whatever they could get)
Also with the militia act of 1808 I wouldn't doubt many militias and guardsman brought them.

Pennsylvania long rifle.
Reason? It is the Pennsylvania long rifle that is your reason!



Flintlock muskets make imbalance in gameplay. Brown Bess easily shoot shooters with Springfield rifles https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F9hrB-eaajI&feature=related

DarthTaco
08-22-2016, 06:15 PM
If I remember right, most 1816 flinters were converted to percussion, it would make sense to me. Why use an inferior (and at this point a minority) firing mechanism, let alone why equip men with them en masse. You'd be at a bit of a disadvantage in regards to loading time as well, with the extra steps of priming the pan etc.

You know what, you can take a smoothbore flinter and I'll take a percussion cap rifled musket.

thomas aagaard
08-22-2016, 07:39 PM
There is no extra step. With a flintlock you need to prime with powder...
If anything priming a percussion musket need an extra movement, since you need to get a rather small percussion cap and using that to prime... This can be a bit hard especially in cold weather...

The main advantage of the percussion lock is fewer misfires.

DarthTaco
08-22-2016, 09:30 PM
I was referring more to the fact you've got to pour the powder manually, as well as reset the frizzen AND hammer when reloading a flinter, leading to a few more lost seconds (and areas to possibly foul up the reloading process). An open ignition system would (as you stated) lead to a higher chance of miss-fire as well, either from a fouled touch-hole or possible adjustment needed of the flint. I think what I was trying to state is that there's a few more minor (but potentially catastrophic) factors that could lead to a failure to fire as opposed to the updated percussion lock system. As I recall anyhow, most of the flinters had been converted to the new percussion locks anyhow, so I highly doubt they'd get added as flint-lock rifles and muskets.

What would be interesting to see is a difference in reload times between the smooth-bore and rifled muskets.

Legion
08-23-2016, 02:37 AM
I don't think they will be adding different reload speeds, they already have a smoothbore in-game and it takes the same amount of time to reload. They also have the Mississippi which should be a little faster to reload as well.

TooL
08-23-2016, 02:56 PM
Flint musket of the 18th century does not require sleep powder on the shelf, as they have the bare conical hole - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bys_xINB0Hc look 6:00 min.

Also. Recruits Napoleon's army was taught to do 3-4 rounds per minute. I am confident that the veteran soldiers could do 5-6 rounds per minute.

thomas aagaard
08-23-2016, 08:24 PM
It really depend on the model used... Some european powers used muskets that required priming, others did not.
And it made their already poor accuracy even worth.

even without the need of priming, 6 shots is very, very high.
Just putting the musket down and getting a cartridge from your box and loading the powder and bullet easily take 10 seconds.

TooL
08-29-2016, 03:06 PM
I threw the video. For 7 seconds, you can charge the gun, aim and shoot. Especially with a conical hole is the seed will be even faster.
In fact, the musket was a formidable weapon. Battle of Blood River to the Zulu hordes is working well - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Blood_River

Of course, in combat conditions due to stress and various factors rate was lower as the weapon came out:

Some soldiers were so stressed that they loaded their guns time after time but they never fired. (After the battle of Gettysburg the discarded 37,574 rifles were collected and sent to Washington to be inspected and reissued. Approx. 24,000 of them were still loaded, and 75 % of them had 2 to 10 rounds in the barrel. One rifle had been stuffed to the top with 23 rounds !

Mark Adkin calculated the effectiveness of muskets at Waterloo.
In the prolonged fighting for Hougoumont "it took 224 French
musket shots to secure a hit. This is not such a poor performance
as it seems. Most defenders were behind cover of some sort for
much of the time, if only a hedge or a tree. The majority were
behind brick walls."
PS.
More than 60 years after Waterloo, in 1876, in the Battle of Rosebud (USA),
General Crook's troops, 43 officers and 1,000 other ranks armed with modern
carbines and rifles, repulsed several charges made by 800 mounted Sioux
and Cheyenne warriors. The Indians attacked with "an enthusiasm for battle
seldom seen." (- Gregory Michno)
The battle raged for six hours, the soldiers had expended 25,000 rounds of
ammunition, the Indian lost 102 killed and wounded. It gives a rate of 250
rounds/1 casualty. All shots are taken into account, including the ones
fired at very long range. Keep on mind that the target were fast moving
mounted warriors fighting in dispersed formation.

thomas aagaard
08-29-2016, 04:10 PM
Please If you can, post the Primary source about the number of weapons at Gettysburg... and the number of loaded weapons.
I would love to see them.

This "fact" is mentioned in a number of of my books... but they all just use another books as a source. I have been trying to find the primary evidence of this... with out any luck.


The closest I come is the report made by the Acting Chief Ordnance Officer for the Army of Potomac. Lt. John R. Edie.
(http://ebooks.library.cornell.edu/cgi/t/text/pageviewer-idx?c=moawar;cc=moawar;idno=waro0043;q1=John%20R.% 20Edie;view=image;seq=245;size=100;page=root)

He give us a total of 24854 muskets. With no information at all about how many was loaded.


From 1867 we got a text called "A Course of Instruction on Ordnance and Gunnery for Cadets of the United States Military Academy" used at west point. Written by Brevet Colonel JG Benton.

one page 341:
"...of 27,574 muskets picket up on the battlefield of Gettysburg and turned into the Washington Arsenal, at least 24,000 were loaded. About half of this number contained two charges each, about a fourth contained from three to ten charges each and the balance one charge. The largest number of cartridges found in any one piece was twenty three. In some cases the paper of the cartridges was unbroken and in others the powder was uppermost."

He don't give source.

It is found in a subchapter about durability of musket.

So we got one primary source that give a different number and no info on how many was loaded.

And we got what is just an post war anecdote used by a teacher, who might be exaggerating to make a point.
(since he is teaching cadets about this and want to make sure they know to make sure their own men do not load a musket more then one time)

Even if he is not, it is still a secondary source that don't prove much.
But it have been repeated so many times that it is seen as fact.


And you make one mistake. The same mistake made by the people who written about combat stress but clearly never used a musket.

If we define "loaded" as a bullet somewhere in the barrel and a soldier is shooting as fast as possible, then if he get shot there is something like 75+% change of him leaving a loaded gun behind. Since the only time his gun would not be "loaded" is after he fired and until he charge the cartridge... something that... what 5-6 seconds? And any issued with loading would not be getting the bullet into the barrel. (but ramming it or with the caps)

So using the number of loaded weapons can not be used as evidence that the men was not actually trying to kill each other.

---------------
There is one other wartime source about this question that I know of:
An order by Meade to the army of Potomac.

"April 19, 1864
To familiarize the men in the use of their arms an additional expenditure of 10 rounds of small-arm ammunition per man is hereby authorized. Corps commanders will see that immediate measures are taken by subordinate officers to carry out the order. Every man should be made to load and fire his musket under the personal super- vision of a company officer. It is believed there are men in this army who have been in numerous actions without ever firing their guns, and it is known that muskets taken on the battle-fields have been found filled nearly to the muzzle with cartridges. The commanding general cannot impress too earnestly on all officers and men the necessity of preparing themselves for the contingencies of battle."
source (http://ebooks.library.cornell.edu/cgi/t/text/pageviewer-idx?c=moawar;cc=moawar;g=moagrp;xc=1;q1=To%20famil iarize%20the%20men%20in%20the;rgn=full%20text;idno =waro0060;didno=waro0060;view=image;seq=0925)
This do mention the issue for muskets loaded "nearly to the muzzle".
Do this support the story with the numbers? or was is allready then one of the stories told in any army?

But it do show us that the typical soldier was not a crack shot...

crazychester1247
03-16-2017, 02:47 AM
How about the Smith and Wesson Models 1 and 2. They're both very unique weapons for the time.

5613
Model 1: .22 Short rimfire, single action, 7 rounds.

5614
Model 2: .38 S&W rimfire, single action, 5 rounds.

Jordon Brooker
03-16-2017, 06:19 AM
How about the Smith and Wesson Models 1 and 2. They're both very unique weapons for the time.

5613
Model 1: .22 Short rimfire, single action, 7 rounds.

5614
Model 2: .38 S&W rimfire, single action, 5 rounds.

Model 2 is an... interesting... looking Revolver.

JaegerCoyote
03-17-2017, 01:48 PM
In regards to interesting weapons, the 6th Pennsylvania still had their lances in the Maryland Campaign.

relichunter
03-24-2018, 06:41 PM
a very rare scope on a whitworth would be awesome.

crazychester1247
03-25-2018, 03:13 AM
https://i.imgur.com/CYy8744.jpg

Smith and Wesson Model 2 Army. A 6 shot revolver that used pre-made metallic .32 long rimfire cartridges. It was one of the first revolvers to use such ammo. The others being the civilian Smith & Wesson Models 1 and 2 I posted earlier. 35,000 were made for the civil war. All were privately purchased besides 700 that went to the 7th Kentucky Cavalry.

Extracrispi
03-25-2018, 07:15 AM
I know it was more of a thing with the Antebellum-era Texas Rangers and the Mexican-American War, but the Colt Paterson would be a cool addition. Perhaps, officers and NCOs of the Texas Brigade could randomly spawn with them since at least a few of them would have been former members of the Rangers. Some may have even served with John Coffee Hays at Bandera Pass where the revolver saw its combat debut.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colt_Paterson

8127

8126

Saris
03-25-2018, 07:24 AM
I know it was more of a thing with the Antebellum-era Texas Rangers and the Mexican-American War, but the Colt Paterson would be a cool addition. Perhaps, officers and NCOs of the Texas Brigade could randomly spawn with them since at least a few of them would have been former members of the Rangers. Some may have even served with John Coffee Hays at Bandera Pass where the revolver saw its combat debut.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colt_Paterson

8127

8126

Most of the Texas rangers would stay defending the frontier in Texas or join cavalry regiments. Most Texans wanted to be cavalry instead of infantry. But again it can still be possible.

Rey Pizzman
03-25-2018, 08:36 AM
Although not present at Antietam/Sharpsburg, I would like to see an old fashion sawed off shotgun or "scatter gun" used by Southern Cavalry.

crazychester1247
03-25-2018, 08:59 PM
As soon as the cavalry or artillery branch gets released I'm sure we'll get those massive near short-sword sized D-guard Bowies the Confederate cavalry and artillery loved so much. Speaking of artillery and short-swords, I wonder if artillerymen will get access to the Model 1832 Artillery short-sword?

https://i.imgur.com/TZOVivZ.jpg

KnynClust
04-08-2018, 12:15 AM
Will the Colt Walker be in the game? It would be a very interesting Cavalry/Officer revolver to have.

8179

TrustyJam
04-08-2018, 01:53 AM
Will the Colt Walker be in the game? It would be a very interesting Cavalry/Officer revolver to have.

8179

It is in-game.

- Trusty

Wittmann
04-08-2018, 10:56 AM
Sorry a "bit" off topic but will pledge rewards be available to be chosen on every map? Also will pistols be selectable for privates (if a pledge reward) as a secondary weapon?


Thanks in advance for all answers/help.

Bleddyn
04-08-2018, 07:20 PM
I believe that weapon rewards will be class specific. Giving pistols to Privates would greatly unbalance things.

ChairdolfSitler
04-10-2018, 02:27 AM
The Burnside and Enfield Saddle Ring Carbines:
http://antietam.aotw.org/weapons.php?weapon_id=all

UnitScout
04-14-2018, 06:53 AM
How about making the flag for the flag carrier a usable weapon and have the same damage as a rifle butt attack? May it can used to hit multiple guys, use it as an emergency spear, or at least use it to bonk a man on the head. Is it that possible to do that, since the flag carrier has no weapons to defend himself with?

Saris
04-14-2018, 07:17 AM
How about making the flag for the flag carrier a usable weapon and have the same damage as a rifle butt attack? May it can used to hit multiple guys, use it as an emergency spear, or at least use it to bonk a man on the head. Is it that possible to do that, since the flag carrier has no weapons to defend himself with?

The flag bearer will be the mobile spawn point in the future which will make them very valuable. The devs are stated that flag bearers will not carry weapons, which means people will have to guard the guy themselves.

Jackalgunner
05-01-2018, 09:36 AM
Now this is a longshot for only one map, but I think it's worth bringing up all the same since it would really change the way the battle plays out in an amazing way.
8325

The Agar Gun also known as the Union Repeating Gun was a rapid fire artillery piece similar in principle to the Gatling Gun. What's important to note is that unlike the Gatling Gun, this was fielded in the early years of the war.

"In January 1862 the 28th Pennsylvania Volunteer Infantry were said to have used the Agar Guns in a skirmish by Harpers Ferry. In another skirmish at Middleburg, Virginia, on March 29, 1862, a captain by the name of Bartlett recalled Union soldiers firing an Agar Gun at attacking Confederate cavalry at a distance of 800 yards, inflicting many casualties and causing the Rebels to flee. The "Coffee Mill" gun was also used somewhat by the Union during McClellan's Peninsula Campaign in 1862."

Now that's all well and good but how does that play into the Maryland Campaign? WELL LET ME TELL YA!

"In September 1862, Confederates obtained seventeen of the machineguns when they captured Harpers Ferry..."

Now hold up for a second, let's take a look at that again: SEVENTEEN MACHINEGUNS and HARPERS FERRY

'But Jackal, these weren't recorded as being used during the battle of Harpers Ferry!'

True, but then the battle represented in the game will not play out the same as the real battle did.

'Seventeen is way too many!'

You're right, but even having two in a full battle could turn things in the Union's favor if properly positioned. Though if the game continues to scale with player count, I think 4 will be just right. Let me reiterate, Battle not Skirmish.

'A machinegun would be too op! It'll put out too many rounds!'

As a weapon with proprietary ammunition, and no real means of resupply compared to cannons (which I assume the Union will also possess in a full battle at Harper's Ferry), you would likely get a full minute of fire before having a large wheel drawn paper weight that's useless for the rest of the battle.

'That thing will shred lines across the river and completely screw up the balance!'

Not really.

"Its maximum effective range was 800-1000 yards, although its lack of accuracy made it effective only against formations at that range. In formal testing, one sample was fired at a board fence measuring 60 yards long and 7 feet tall, and made 40% hits at 400 yards."

That's abysmal accuracy at longer distances. It would probably be even more inaccurate ingame.

'The Union will just park em at the entrances to the fort and shred everyone charging across!'

Even ignoring the long range accuracy lets look at it from a gameplay perspective. Unlike some of the cannons, the Guns will likely have to moved from town to the battlements if they're going to be used for that purpose which takes time. In doing so they're exposed to confederate cannons which in the first place will be much more effective at distance shooting. Heck, even if they did park them at the ends of the bridges for instance, and the cannoneers can't hit them because they drank too much, they're still vulnerable to infantry fire. It seems like the early war versions didn't have armored plates for the operator to hide behind though I have no source to explicitly confirm that.
8326

'Assuming there isn't a problem getting into the fort, what then? They'll just park it on one of the inner streets and rack up 30 kills when the confederates charge!'

Harpers Ferry is huge! There are a ton of streets and alleys. The guns can easily be out maneuvered! Remember those giant wooden railway bridges around the place? The guns dont have an elevation that can shoot that high. You could have some skirmishers run up there and shoot down at the crew. You can have a scout point it out, fight through Union resistance on an alternate route and bayonet the punks. And honestly if you're too high on the charge to warn your buddies that there's Automatic Death at the end of the street well that's just fun gameplay for the other guys.

'They'll just park it on an elevated position like the hill or the very same railway bridge!'

You mean a place that's vulnerable to Confederate cannons, is only setup for shooting farther distances (don't forget about those accuracy problems now), and can't really shoot down? You'll be fine.
Also, you can't really park this thing on an incline in the first place.

'Well apart from the novelty of a line wipe by a cool piece of weapons history, what strategic use does it have? How does it fit into the metagame?'

What killin' fools ain't good enough for ya? But you know the real beauty of this is deterrence, some streets on Harpers Ferry are less maneuverable than others. Now no one will want to charge up this hill or go down that street near the walls if there's a machinegun there. And those are just a couple examples.

'Canister or grape shot would do the same for less work.'

Not really, a cannon has different tactical implications as it only fires once. Cannon fires, enemy charges the crew. But now, Agar Gun fires...and fires... and fires... Whelp looks like you're not going there. Now the Officers have to make a decision to try and tough it out, or deal with an alternate route that is sporting more defenders as a result of the machinegun cover.

That's about all I can think of at the moment, it's pretty late. If I think of anything else I'll add it.

Sources:
Pritchard, Russ A., Jnr. (2003). Civil War Weapons and Equipment. Guilford, CT: Lyons Press.
http://www.forgottenweapons.com/manual-machine-guns/union-repeating-gun/

LaBelle
05-01-2018, 09:46 AM
... You want to give the Union two repeating guns on Harper's Ferry? Who hurt you?

Jackalgunner
05-01-2018, 10:02 AM
Yep, the Harpers Ferry with 200(+?) combatants and player operated artillery that's planned. Again let me reiterate BATTLE not SKIRMISH. I'm talking release or post release my man.

Though I have to say, having one on the first layout of the Harpers Ferry skirmish without any confederate artillery to counter would be pretty funny. Well, for the Union anyways.

Volks63
05-01-2018, 11:22 AM
M1861 Springfield

Hinkel
05-01-2018, 12:16 PM
M1861 Springfield

Which is in since the release of the drill camp? :)

Redleader
05-01-2018, 03:10 PM
As a Belgian representative I must thank both sides in the conflict for buying our :

- 20-30 years old antiques (some genuisly homemade converted from flint to percussion).
- some of our inferiour quality copies of some good muskets/rifles, like the P53 Enfield (we'll fire the quality control manager soon)
- english stamped rifles, so that the english can charge you about 20% more
- kick as a mule, recoil masterpieces (how otherwise you would know that you fired your musket in a large line battle ?)

To quote 'Grant' on some of the comments he made about our export products :

- "Almost as dangerous to the one firing it as the one aimed at ..."
- "... might fire at you all day without you ever finding out about it.'

That's our contribution, we do not make weapons to kill but rather for psychological effect, on the one handling and the one getting targeted ... no thanks needed !
Our factory in Liege is doing fine and we still arm various countries in the world, lot of conflicts involve our Belgian weapons ... beats being know for waffles/chocolate/sprouts/asperges/beer .... right ?

Jackalgunner
05-02-2018, 05:15 AM
It now occurs to me that the way I described the Union Repeating Gun of which THERE WERE 17 AT HARPERS FERRY likely brought up fears of a WW1 style infantry meat grinder and probably turned a lot of people off the idea. (In my enthusiasm to share information about the weapon, my words might have given credence to the idea)

So let me put out some additional information to assuage any fears of belt fed roaring monstrosities and magazine fed rotating barrels of balance killing:

1. The Union Repeating Gun has an ammunition capacity of 25 rounds and is prone to overheating. - So while it can fire more than a cannon in a smaller timeframe, pause it's firing when necessary, and fire continuously while being loaded, those two limiting factors mean that it cannot keep up its rate of fire indefinitely.

2. When you do reload it(from the ammo crates attached to the carriage) each cartridge must be properly loaded to prevent malfunction. - That's right Artillery boys, this is still a crew served weapon. Someone's gotta move it, someone's gotta to load it, and someone's gotta to shoot it. Loading properly also means that loading while continuously firing the weapon could cause feeding issues so a crew has to decide if continued fire is worth the risk of a jam in the ammunition tray. Clearing a jam is not very complicated but could be time consuming and exposing enough for the crew to get taken out.

3. The carriage for the Union Repeating Gun has limited range of motion that impedes operation. - While it's true the gun can swivel to a certain degree and the carriage can be moved, it is ultimately difficult to aim when firing it.

Everything else aside and speaking from a historical perspective, if the Confederates carried out their planned storming of Harpers Ferry, this weapon would have been used.

See for yourself:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P767jNWeryM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gcsviX3clZU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mw9UFaxpkRA

Bleddyn
05-02-2018, 05:54 AM
.....if the Confederates carried out their planned storming of Harpers Ferry, this weapon would have been used.

The map has balance issues enough as it is, a weapon like this would completely kill gameplay (as in servers emptying for another map). I can't see how that would be an improvement to the game.

I am all for as much realism as possible, but if it stops people from playing what benefit would there be?

Wilhelm von Straussberry
05-02-2018, 07:39 AM
I went through this entire thread and NOT ONCE did I see anyone here even mention the BEST rifle used in the Civil War!!!

Yep, that's right!

I'm talkin' about the biggest, baddest, greatest, MOST EFFICIENT KILLING TOOL EVER DEVELOPED...




----------------------------------------------------------------------------------what could it be?

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------have I finally reached enlightenment?
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------am I dead?----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------why am I asking all of these questions?

---------------have I crossed into another dimension?
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------who is this man?



-------------------------------------------------------God himself must've crafted this weapon...

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------why has he chosen me to witness this miracle?


---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------SHOW ME THIS GUN ALREADY!!!



-----------------------------where am I?






http://media.liveauctiongroup.net/i/10246/11003563_1.jpg?v=8CE2727AA55B4D0

The S P R I N G F I E L D M O D E L 1 7 9 5 Musket


:P

LaBelle
05-02-2018, 08:15 AM
So on a map where the Confederates have to storm across a football field and a half of open bridge, a map where two union lines can poach one bridge with a tunnel at the end and an overhang above, a map that features a rail bridge that breaks open into a stone wall covered area, a map where the confederates must then push across an open street to find cover and take the point...

And you want to add not one, but two repeating guns? And you think some Confederate artillery in the forest is a good counter?

Deal. But the CSA must be allowed to set up canister loaded cannons at Burnside's Bridge.

Jackalgunner
05-03-2018, 07:13 PM
I'll meet you half way. One Union Repeating Gun has only half ammunition and one in 15 privates at Burnside's Bridge gets a Double Barrel Shotgun and a bowie knife.

8343

8344

Jackalgunner
05-06-2018, 09:11 AM
But wait there's more! (repeating information too but eh)

Used by the 28th Pennsylvania in a skirmish near Middleburg, Virginia, in late March of 1862. The guns decimated confederate cavalry but were shipped back in April due to overblown concerns of safety (and the general incompetence necessary to rag on a weapon that won you the battle, "inefficient" my butt).

17 at Harpers Ferry captured by Confederate forces before they could be issued. I haven't really found anything about the Confederates using them afterwards.

McClellan possessed 50 Agar Guns in the Penninsula Campaign as reported by British Military Observers. Something to think about for the future, eh?

"Governor Andrew Curtin of Pennsylvania made sure that many of his state’s infantry regiments approached Richmond armed with machine guns. A private in the 83rd Pennsylvania wrote that 'all the Pennsylvania regiments have them.'" (Spring 1862)

The 96th Pennsylvania were well known for possessing one throughout the war, they even have a picture with it (I'm pretty sure I posted it earlier in the thread). I think a museum in Pennsylvania still has their gun.
The 49th Pennsylvania employed a 'Coffee Mill' at the Battle at Golding’s Farm on June 28, 1862.
The 31st New York possessed one and complained about it.
The 56th New York Volunteers fielded one at Yorktown but abandoned it further into the campaign. (presumably from spent ammunition)
The 1st New Jersey fielded seven at the Battle of Gains Mill on June 27, 1862. The 96th was also present here and may have contributed or fielded theirs.
Unknown amount fielded at the Battle of Seven Pines. It's also worth noting that the Confederate Williams Gun was also fielded here.
Unknown amount used at Petersburg (along with a Gatling gun).
Ten were ordered by Rosecrans but didn't make it in time for Chickamauga. They were probably the guns that got stuck on some patrol boats that saw no action. (which is a shame because that means no vietnam style gunboat shenanigans)
Unknown amount at Crampton's Gap (South Mountain). The 31st New York (which guarded the Fairfax Railroad with one not long before) and the 96th Pennsylvania were present here.
Two were used at the Battle of Williamsburg in May, 1862 under the 12th New York Militia (called the Excelsior Brigade lol).

There's probably more but I think this is pretty good for now.

When Richard Gatling shilled his product, he sold it as being not “the inferior arm known as the ‘coffee mill gun.’”

calmmyst
05-07-2018, 01:34 AM
http://www.civilwarartillery.com/cannon/Dictator_small1.jpg I would like to see the use of this 13 inch mortar on the field of battle, LOL It would be just fun to fire it in game.

Detective Bulletstorm
05-07-2018, 03:26 AM
I'm not sure if this has been said already but I'd want to see the Remington Model 1858 that'd so be wait I'd keep on me.

JaegerCoyote
05-07-2018, 11:53 PM
The 1858 is ingame, its one of the pistols you can spawn with.

McMuffin
05-09-2018, 12:52 AM
Why do people want rapid fire machine guns so badly? They cite a source that says a regiment in an enormous battle had one and think it should be included.

Bleddyn
05-09-2018, 09:57 PM
Why do people want rapid fire machine guns so badly? They cite a source that says a regiment in an enormous battle had one and think it should be included.

I have seen it in almost every game with a historical setting. People want their own favorite rare weapon included. Any minor historical plausibility is all they consider, the fact that it would be the the worst possible thing for the actual enjoyment of the game seems not to matter.

Kyle422
05-09-2018, 11:02 PM
I do not agree with adding a weapon that was only fielded once or seen VERY limited combat. I think just the standard normal weapons are fine. It makes the game interesting and a lot of times especially with this game. It depended on which side is more Disciplined and has the commander that knows how to react to the changing situations on the battlefield. There is no real big weapon advantages in WoR. For the most part both sides pretty much have the same weapons.


- Kyle

Elias Stars
07-21-2018, 05:44 PM
It would be pretty amazing if they put some mortar and artillery into the field of play.

It would probably need a simplistic aiming system so people would use them, but it would still be cool to be able to use a trig card for ranging.
And maybe artillery pieces could be available through your company. As a company growth reward or something.

John Cooley
07-21-2018, 06:21 PM
I have to agree with Kyle ...
unless they want to add saddle mounted Gatling Guns THEN I am all FOR expanding beyond "common use" weaponry. ;)

Bad Adz84
09-12-2018, 07:13 PM
Sorry guys if it's been asked before, but is there any chance we'll see the Henry and Spencer repeaters? Granted the they might be a bit overpowered but it can be offset with overheating; the rifle accuracy depreciates after rapid fire.

TrustyJam
09-12-2018, 07:17 PM
Sorry guys if it's been asked before, but is there any chance we'll see the Henry and Spencer repeaters? Granted the they might be a bit overpowered but it can be offset with overheating; the rifle accuracy depreciates after rapid fire.

Spencers weren't adopted by the army until 63 and an extremely low amount of Henry's were privately purchased and used. We have no current plans of introducing them and if we ever will they will be so rare that having them in the first place would seem a bit of a waste of work. :)

- Trusty

Bad Adz84
09-12-2018, 08:42 PM
Thank you for replying so quickly. So one more thing i'd like to add on the topic of weapons while surfing the net i've been blown away by the amount of different types there are, from sidearm, melee and rifle. There is a lot of material to work with here and was wondering whether Campfire would consider selling them as additional, like an Arkansas bowie knife, hell i'd pay for that.
I understand this takes away from the authenticity to a degree but a personal side arm or knife, would make me feel a little more comfortable in those final moments. The other point is that I wouldn't expect this to be used in an organized event or sponsored match, battle etc. Perhaps in for small scale skirmish matches, maybe private server battle etc... hmm maybe this could of gone in suggestions, anyway don't make me pressure you into making a model Henry :rolleyes:

Saris
09-12-2018, 09:14 PM
Bowie knives, Arkansas Toothpicks, etc. were not uncommon—not sure how they'd implement knives in the game, but I'd love one. Color Sergeants often tucked away pocket guns, too, but for gameplay purposes I guess we'll probably never see a purse gun for the colors.

http://scvtuscaloosa.org/6thla/la-irishfight.jpg
Louisiana Tigers go hand-to-hand with the Irish Brigade

I would love to see units be able to carry extra swords or knifes, I know the Wheat's Tigers carried Bowie knifes and I wouldnt be surprised if others carried melee weapons. Maybe even making the bayonet able to be carried by hand to use in melee

McMuffin
09-12-2018, 11:36 PM
Even though I'm not in favor of adding things like knives, instead of making them usable, just put it as a cosmetic item that would be very very rare. Because come on, know how weird it would look to see like three guys coming at you in a civil war game with a knife?

Poorlaggedman
09-13-2018, 01:15 AM
First make hand-to-hand rarer in gameplay then make it special. Did anyone actually use a knife in combat in the Civil War? I'm sure it has to have happened but are there any documented instances? Some showmen today carry big-ass knifes on their body armor but nobody actually uses them in combat. Big difference. Those types of things are the type of nuances they put in sub-par games that haven't really gotten the gameplay right enough to the point you wouldn't think you'd need those sort of things.

Bad Adz84
09-13-2018, 12:50 PM
First make hand-to-hand rarer in gameplay then make it special. Did anyone actually use a knife in combat in the Civil War? I'm sure it has to have happened but are there any documented instances? Some showmen today carry big-ass knifes on their body armor but nobody actually uses them in combat. Big difference. Those types of things are the type of nuances they put in sub-par games that haven't really gotten the gameplay right enough to the point you wouldn't think you'd need those sort of things.

I think you're on point here and some of those skirmish maps are prime hand-to-hand at times, making those circumstances rarer will happen on the bigger maps I'm guessing? But really depends on the method of contention. Another way to look at it is realistically soldiers wore them and seemed to use them depending on the nature of the battle. I've read some interesting articles recently, namely letters from the Battle of Allatoona which depicts fierce melee from saber to rocks, even strangulation. I'm guessing any sort of blade would have been used here. Those recorded instances are honestly few and far between though, coupled with very patchy statistics from the time. I also read that close quarters at Gettysberg for example, where swords, knives and bayonet were used only made up about 10% of casualties combined. The enemy were more inclined to route from intense fire than hold the line to the very end i'm guessing?
I'm not sure how Campfire wish to proceed into the future, whether the Maryland campaign is it or maybe expand with other campaign dlc and add further weapons types to it perhaps?

Shocktroop3012
09-13-2018, 08:31 PM
First make hand-to-hand rarer in gameplay then make it special. Did anyone actually use a knife in combat in the Civil War? I'm sure it has to have happened but are there any documented instances? Some showmen today carry big-ass knifes on their body armor but nobody actually uses them in combat. Big difference. Those types of things are the type of nuances they put in sub-par games that haven't really gotten the gameplay right enough to the point you wouldn't think you'd need those sort of things.

I guess I was a showman then. ;) I carried a big ol knife downrange and in some instances, a pretty handy composite tomahawk. Ammo goes quick but thankfully, I never had to put it to the test but I wasn't going to get captured or go down without a fight so at the time, it wasn't showy at all. Always be prepared.

https://taskandpurpose.com/5-harrowing-stories-hand-hand-combat-iraq-afghanistan/

Saris
09-13-2018, 09:00 PM
First make hand-to-hand rarer in gameplay then make it special. Did anyone actually use a knife in combat in the Civil War? I'm sure it has to have happened but are there any documented instances? Some showmen today carry big-ass knifes on their body armor but nobody actually uses them in combat. Big difference. Those types of things are the type of nuances they put in sub-par games that haven't really gotten the gameplay right enough to the point you wouldn't think you'd need those sort of things.

I'm not looking to add one handed melee weapons now but I would love to see them implemented later in development. I know at the Battle of First Bull Run, the Wheat's Tigers tossed their Mississippi rifles charged with their bowie knifes drawn through the cornfield and engaged the 2nd Rhode Island in a brief melee fight before retreating.

Sox
09-15-2018, 11:59 PM
I have no doubt that knives were carried, and on occasion even used. I would definately dispute that they were used to any great extent, and especially not in the East. In a game where the 'Rambo' is frowned upon, adding knives would only encourage them even more. It's a bit like saying ''well lets add the Gattling gun'' just because they 'had them'.

thomas aagaard
09-16-2018, 11:00 AM
I'm not looking to add one handed melee weapons now but I would love to see them implemented later in development. I know at the Battle of First Bull Run, the Wheat's Tigers tossed their Mississippi rifles charged with their bowie knifes drawn through the cornfield and engaged the 2nd Rhode Island in a brief melee fight before retreating.
Do you have any good sources on it?
It is not mentioned in the report by Major Wheat in the Official Records and sound like a very bad idea, since there is no way you know for sure that you will be able to get back to your gun and pick it up. So I would love to read a but more about it.

thomas aagaard
09-16-2018, 09:07 PM
Thanks. Always great when people are willing to share their knowledge and sources. :-)

When you have a musket with a bayonet, it make little sense to drop it and use a knife instead.
(maybe in a trench or similar there are situations where it make sense, but not during combat in the open)

But it do make a lot more sense, when the fact that they did not have bayonets get added to the story.
(or sword bayonets as was the correct weapon for the rifle.)


In the game I think the question is pretty simple. If there are documented cases of units at the battle that did not have bayonets... then yes, giving them knives and similar instead would make sense.

Zeldov
12-24-2018, 09:26 PM
So as of december 2018, you can't reload revolvers, but I was thinking since the confederates have access to the LeMat, which is incredibly powerful and versatile, we could give players the ability to reload the Remington New Model Army, as it was easier and faster to reload than all of the other revolvers in the game, and make it Union only, as they were the main buyer.

JB Gordon
01-25-2019, 01:17 AM
the sabre defiantly needs to do more damage...

LuxCapere
02-08-2019, 01:54 AM
Currently, the bayonets and rifle buttstocks DO NOT actually do different amounts of damage.

It takes two hits from each for a kill, unless the target is already damaged.

Bayonets should always be instant kill when attacking after sprinting (charging in melee mode) for a certain amount of time (you SHOULDNT be able to just spam shift or tap it once after getting close to an enemy for the power buff).

Other than that, when you stab someone in the face with a bayonet, THEY SHOULD DIE. Right now, it takes two hits with little to no penalty for being hit other than a darkened, grey screen. Really, stabbing them anywhere in the upper torso or gut, would (reallistically) be a knockout and (at least, eventually) a death blow...

If you can get a " sprinting (charge) 'headshot' " with a rifle buttstock, I think that should also count as an instant kill. Smacking someone in the face with a heavy wooden buttstock should feel beefy, especially on and for the first swing.

TrustyJam
02-08-2019, 07:17 AM
Currently, the bayonets and rifle buttstocks DO NOT actually do different amounts of damage.

It takes two hits from each for a kill, unless the target is already damaged.

Bayonets should always be instant kill when attacking after sprinting (charging in melee mode) for a certain amount of time (you SHOULDNT be able to just spam shift or tap it once after getting close to an enemy for the power buff).

Other than that, when you stab someone in the face with a bayonet, THEY SHOULD DIE. Right now, it takes two hits with little to no penalty for being hit other than a darkened, grey screen. Really, stabbing them anywhere in the upper torso or gut, would (reallistically) be a knockout and (at least, eventually) a death blow...

If you can get a " sprinting (charge) 'headshot' " with a rifle buttstock, I think that should also count as an instant kill. Smacking someone in the face with a heavy wooden buttstock should feel beefy, especially on and after the first swing.

Yes they do.

2 stabs from a bayonet and 3 hits from the club to kill someone with full health.

- Trusty

Sharkboi
04-18-2019, 03:21 AM
I had a revolver suggestion/idea. Is it better if I post it here or make a different thread? Only asking because im new. I wanna help get as much historical content in this game as possible to make the game more enjoyable for the fanbase ^^

Lamb
04-18-2019, 10:32 PM
being able to mess with the sights with out aiming. i find it a bit slow to keep hitting z to change the sights range going up little by little. maybe we can use the mouse wheel to set it and when we aim it sets it to that range. also being able to zoom in slightly with shift or use it as hold breath

Jeb
04-27-2019, 01:06 AM
sharps carbine for me :) and represents cavalry - but when you join or forum a company should the weapons reflect that rather then lucky dip? just a thought while we talking weapons.