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Thread: Officers, Officer Rambos...

  1. #61
    Quote Originally Posted by Fancy Sweetroll View Post
    So why not make it so that when the officer kills somebody, it doesnt cost any morale for the other team.
    I don't know how I feel about monkeying with morale costs so much. It'll look like the tax code if we go down the road of tweaks to fix this and that and TBH I'd prefer a flat-tax on deaths of any kind in the end (fixed reinforcements with morale being another team factor perhaps dictating spawnability convenience). What you'd basically be doing is expanding on the fact that getting killed out of line is already very costly. So these rambo officers, even when they kill 5-6 are breaking even or worse - unless they are killing other rambos. The main inconvenience is the breakthrough and chaos they cause in many cases.

    I really think autosurrender has an enormous benefit. I heard the idea many a years ago by some other realism gamers and I'm unaware of it ever being implemented. I think it'd be a worthy experiment and would lay down the law on people who think they can rambo with impunity and mitigate them to minute-men style tactics at best.

    As far as the best idea for making use of officers in particular, aside from autosurrender (which will help), is allowing servers to limit the number of times any unique steamid can spawn as an officer / flag bearer in a round and unallocating that role and kicking them back to make another selection after they've maxed their deaths in that role. That will change the attitude of experienced players who want to play officer if they know it's one-and-done.

    I want to see it so officers can have their reloads, a whole bunch of them. That means something on the radical-end has to be done. Personally... an officer's role should be to lead not to kill and as a semi-role player I see myself seeing dishonor in relying on my own shots as routine as many lend to rather than those I'm trying to lead.


    Quote Originally Posted by Bivoj View Post
    When the player reaches autosurrender triggered “area” (out of formation close to “in formation” enemy unit) a countdown (like the one “you are about to desert”) would start with the message “you are outnumbered, you are going to surrender”. The player should either retreat or casualty...
    Not a bad idea but it'd be nice if it could be turned off as not to become a serious nuisance when you are a player who pushes the edges on occasion like that.
    Last edited by Poorlaggedman; 01-04-2018 at 02:35 AM.

  2. #62
    I have said this many times, but...

    I am bewildered; genuinely, as to why people's first solution to poor player behavior makes the morale costlier and screw the team over for what a Rambo did, it is a system that is way too simple. We need a system that is complex, no way around it, and does take into account multiple scenarios.

    There is entirely no way around the fact that this is a thorny issue to tackle, but you do not always address a difficult problem with a simple solution. For this issue, any ideas from auto-surrender, demotion or barring from officer rank, or outright killing them will work, but it needs to be sophisticated enough to take into account the multiple scenarios an officer who does not plan on going Rambo will encounter as not to punish him. This is not an easy issue, nor it is a pure 'open and shut' fix.

    I cannot stress enough how little morale tweaking will do, regarding unit wide morale, to fix this. Morale is good for only a unit the way we have it now and is not meant to punish the team for one person's mistake. Honestly, the harsher you make the morale punishments, the more Rambo officers looking to anger the team or even sabotage a game will pop up because trolls revel in that anger and attention, and a high price tag right now will not ward them off from doing so.

    However, this solution also has to be harsh and direct, not passive and indirect. Morale is a passive and indirect solution to this, won't work. You need something radical like autokill (as I suggested), booting them from the role for the duration of the game, or something else. Whatever the solution is, it addresses the problem right then and there and puts an end to it and something that punishes them as an individual. Moreover, the way you implement this base feature can decide how complicated it will be, but it has to be very well thought out and take into account many many situations.

    I know I repeated myself many times in this post, but it is only because I am very frustrated as I am seeing the same solution brought up by people that are some reskinned version of the morale system coming in to play.

  3. #63
    WoR-Dev TrustyJam's Avatar
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    We’re not looking at making the officer death costlier in terms of the team morale.

    We’ve begun work on the first officer rambo specific system which we’ll roll out for you all to test as soon as it is ready.

    Thank you all for your feedback on this matter.

    - Trusty

  4. #64
    Quote Originally Posted by TrustyJam View Post
    We’re not looking at making the officer death costlier in terms of the team morale.

    We’ve begun work on the first officer rambo specific system which we’ll roll out for you all to test as soon as it is ready.

    Thank you all for your feedback on this matter.

    - Trusty
    Good to hear that the morale will, for lack of words and to sounds less eloquent, not be fucked with to address this issue.

    Appreciate you listening to us and attempting to solve this issue.

  5. #65

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    Quote Originally Posted by Poorlaggedman View Post
    If we listened to the naysayers this would be like any other game that failed with line combat. Let's be clear that it's never been done well in a video game and nothing is getting done by business as usual. There's no magic chemistry here in the community that will bring forth a good destination unless serious time and planning is put into it. Forget about the fairy tale that all we need is artillery and cavalry and 400 person servers and the game is complete.

    I keep saying this and disregard it at your own peril: You shouldn't punish the whole team for the specific actions of a minority of players. And a collection of bonuses and penalties isn't necessarily needed or beneficial in all cases.

    Look at it this way. You have three types of players. Those that 'behave.' Those that don't. And those that are between. The players who 'behave' on both teams are killing each other. Each 'in line' casualty is 1 ticket loss. Those players are killing each other and occasionally clashing with the other two groups but they bore the brunt of fighting this particular hypothetical map round. What are the other players doing? If they're killing each other 'out of line' or 'skirmishing' then each casualty is 3 or even 6 tickets lost. This is where the battle is decided in many cases -- not by the players 'in line.' The bulk of losses are coming from players who aren't even behaving according to the standards set forth. It's how well they perform that decides the round. This is not something I'd like to see expanded on because making an 'out of line' officer count more than six times the ticket loss is just crazy. What are you gonna do? 12 times? There's the whole round right there if he's off running around 10 times. Players will have no clue why rounds go certain ways, as they don't really now a lot. Don't assume spawn times are a real deterrent unless you're willing to make them stupidly, annoyingly long at the detriment to the occasional honest player getting caught up in off-circumstances for no good reason.
    unlike most folks .. when I am in a discussion I listen... and you have made your point... I now also agree the extra ticket loss is a no go.. don't want or need it.

    but I still like the extra timer, and especially like fancy sweetrolls idea... I 1 up that.
    All governments, everywhere derived its power by the consent of the people. The government you have is by your own consent. Not by those brave grey dead of one hundred and fifty plus years ago.

  6. #66
    Hi all ,

    i checked out all your suggestions and speechees about "Rambo" , but the real fact, the players use rambo strategy only when we are 16 or less on the server not when you are full on the server(meant 45vs45) and now with a new update, i mean press "F9" (camera on game, this function it is only for youtuber, i am not against this idea but just one guys can give the possition to the enemy, is it not a cheat ? ) we 're doing that on real life ? I think not.

    During the War the blue coat for the confederate uniform it was real why you want delete this, check your back yankee 's players it is a Skirmish mod we are, you know the sens of this word or need a dictionary for the definition. Well my opinion about this, you dont need talking about rambo or other thing let the Dev's build this game quietly and give a good feedback to them and dont complain about your own problem and pretend it is for the comunity. You never said something an other thread when the yankee are OP about moral and tickets system, mmm... ? And last things gentlemens, Do you think that in a game you can do all as in the true life, I do not think , but you get closer only and it is a 3D game.

    We must adapt to the situation of the Games , if the developers can improve the quality of the game with our feedback, it is goodl but if they cannot then , we must adapt.
    Last edited by FIGHT Black phoenix; 01-05-2018 at 04:08 AM.
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  7. #67

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    Quote Originally Posted by FIGHT Black phoenix View Post
    Hi all ,

    i checked out all your suggestions and speechees about "Rambo" , but the real fact, the players use rambo strategy only when we are 16 or less on the server not when you are full on the server(meant 45vs45) and now with a new update, i mean press "F9" (camera on game, this function it is only for youtuber, i am not against this idea but just one guys can give the possition to the enemy, is it not a cheat ? ) we 're doing that on real life ? I think not.

    During the War the blue coat for the confederate uniform it was real why you want delete this, check your back yankee 's players it is a Skirmish mod we are, you know the sens of this word or need a dictionary for the definition. Well my opinion about this, you dont need talking about rambo or other thing let the Dev's build this game quietly and give a good feedback to them and dont complain about your own problem and pretend it is for the comunity. You never said something an other thread when the yankee are OP about moral and tickets system, mmm... ? And last things gentlemens, Do you think that in a game you can do all as in the true life, I do not think , but you get closer only and it is a 3D game.

    We must adapt to the situation of the Games , if the developers can improve the quality of the game with our feedback, it is goodl but if they cannot then , we must adapt.
    amen... my brother.. you spoke well.... that is the crux of it all, and I know you ... you.. only want what is right, and fair,,, again amen to you... my friend.
    All governments, everywhere derived its power by the consent of the people. The government you have is by your own consent. Not by those brave grey dead of one hundred and fifty plus years ago.

  8. #68
    thanks Brother to support me !
    Captain P. Clebrune
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    In 6th Louisana Tiger Batallion


  9. #69

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    Quote Originally Posted by FIGHT Black phoenix View Post
    Hi all ,

    i checked out all your suggestions and speechees about "Rambo" , but the real fact, the players use rambo strategy only when we are 16 or less on the server not when you are full on the server(meant 45vs45) and now with a new update, i mean press "F9" (camera on game, this function it is only for youtuber, i am not against this idea but just one guys can give the possition to the enemy, is it not a cheat ? ) we 're doing that on real life ? I think not.
    I'm sorry, but I find your post a bit confusing. What does the camera have to do with "Rambos officers"?

    Also, isn't giving our personal views an important part of taking part in a technical alpha?

  10. #70
    Quote Originally Posted by FIGHT Black phoenix View Post
    Hi all ,

    i checked out all your suggestions and speechees about "Rambo" , but the real fact, the players use rambo strategy only when we are 16 or less on the server not when you are full on the server(meant 45vs45) and now with a new update, i mean press "F9" (camera on game, this function it is only for youtuber, i am not against this idea but just one guys can give the possition to the enemy, is it not a cheat ? ) we 're doing that on real life ? I think not.

    During the War the blue coat for the confederate uniform it was real why you want delete this, check your back yankee 's players it is a Skirmish mod we are, you know the sens of this word or need a dictionary for the definition. Well my opinion about this, you dont need talking about rambo or other thing let the Dev's build this game quietly and give a good feedback to them and dont complain about your own problem and pretend it is for the comunity. You never said something an other thread when the yankee are OP about moral and tickets system, mmm... ? And last things gentlemens, Do you think that in a game you can do all as in the true life, I do not think , but you get closer only and it is a 3D game.

    We must adapt to the situation of the Games , if the developers can improve the quality of the game with our feedback, it is goodl but if they cannot then , we must adapt.
    While you may not view this to be a regularly occurring issue on bigger games as of right now (even though I have seen it multiple times on bigger events, it is common), it would still have the potential to become an issue and a big one in the future. So why not provide feedback and suggestions on the mechanics right now to prevent it from becoming a widespread issue? Especially when the game opens up to more people and what may seem like a minority now could grow in size. Why is giving our opinions on something for the forums of a game a bad thing, why else are any of us here on the forums if not to discuss the game and its mechanics and future?

    And also, a lot of people have complained, myself included, in the past about the ticket and moral system being unfair to the Confederate team, so it seems odd to say that you saw a lack of people complaining. If you read my post(s), you even saw that I was against the morale system adjustments because it was already hindering the CSA too much. And when a "3D game" prides itself in being incredibly realistic and detailed, we will absolutely hold it to that standard. Some people do not like the F9 camera as they feel it can allow for cheating. But it does not make the core game unrealistic as it is not a mechanic of the game like bayonet damage, weapon reloading, etc.

    As for the last part, I'm confused as to what you are trying to say, sorry.
    Last edited by McMuffin; 01-06-2018 at 11:00 PM. Reason: typo fix

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