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Thread: Delirium tremens

  1. #11
    WoR-Dev TrustyJam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ragnar hairy trousers View Post
    Sorry i was not clear about base spawn... i never meant get rid of the base spawn.

    As for point 13. the improved accuracy does help the lone soldier/sharpshooter but then he is not close to his mobile spawn the line he is shooting at also has improved accuracy and spawn ability and can deal with the threat posed by the lone sharpshooter, he may hinder them a little but thats all he will do. Whereas without the mobile spawn a lone shooter can do alot of damage to a unit .
    Yes, the introduction of the flag bearer spawning system will certainly change things up quite a bit.

    - Trusty

  2. #12
    As things stand its a bit backwards...

    the lone sharpshooter is not the best shot the lads in line are!!!

    The soldier chosen to fight alone or in a skirmish line are generally the best shots in the unit.

    Having these "crack shots" loose their ability to shoot straight because they are not with a bunch of other guys is odd indeed. Skirmishers were trained to fight as skirmishers and sharpshooters tended to be lads who fought best alone or at least in small groups.
    Sergeant Ragnar Hairy Trousers
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  3. #13
    OH I forgot point 14 lol

    14. With the standard as mobile spawn and the need to protect this valuable asset there will be no need for the morale penalties for not being "in line" which force people to form tight
    groups even when it does not suite the situation.

    A mobile spawn could remove the need to FORCE people to form line and allow officers more tactical flexibility ...
    Sergeant Ragnar Hairy Trousers
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  4. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by TrustyJam View Post
    1-9 is already verified to be on the way into the game and will cover most of your ideas.

    2 and 10 counter each other (you absolutely will need a base spawn area as an optional spawn position).

    13: I disagree. Improved rifle accuracy helps the lone guy as much as it does the group in formation (note that the group in formation already currently have 50% less sway than the dude out of line).

    - Trusty
    point 2 means the standard bearer respawns at base area when killed.
    point 10 means regimental colours not national colours as spawns lest there be too many spawns.

    these points do not counter one another sir

    kind regards

    Raggy
    Sergeant Ragnar Hairy Trousers
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  5. #15
    I just wish it was more dynamic, dependent on the player's condition instead of the same general sway pattern. Maybe I'm wrong but that seems like what it is. I'd prefer the game attempt modeling adrenaline at various stages. Even to the point where one of these mobile juggernaut line spawns with colors that are coming actually spawn people in similar starting state. This way the best strategy is what everyone would benefit from, a more continuous front of lines that will fall back to recover rather than facing obliteration 98% of the time (reckless suicidal charges and stands). So what I'm getting at is if your line sprints from the spawn all the way to the fight, or otherwise exhausts itself, then the players who spawn on that line will be in a similar state of recovery from that exhaustion. Make the level of exhaustion and fatigue more dynamic. Life isn't as simple as "rush, rush, rush, gimme two minutes- okay I'm good." It all matters. Real-life: Your men are totally exhausted, adrenaline going though- they need water, you cross a stream on the way in to combat. Do you let them stop and get a drink? No, they'll crash and burn and the adrenaline will be gone. These things are complicated but they should be implemented on some small level because there is actually data out there.
    Last edited by Poorlaggedman; 02-02-2018 at 06:47 PM.
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  6. #16
    I'm gonna save everyone a lot of breath here, here you go Ragnar.

    Accuracy/Weapon Sway Thread
    Springfield 1842 Debate/Other Subjects you mention also
    Another weapon sway thread
    Specific Flag Bearer Thread

    For the morale penalties, here is everything you could wonder about it on the forums;
    Officers and morale
    Morale in general and how it should affect gameplay

  7. #17

    CSA Captain

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    With the system that is in game already, at some point, I'd hope/imagine that some kind of system will be implemented to accommodate skirmishers because obviously they were part of the Civil War. If they limit the amount of players that can spawn as a skirmisher, and remove the class from the current morale system, that should serve for example. I fully support the way the Devs are trying to get line fighting to be THE way to go for WoR, but at the same time there obviously need to be some exceptions.

    Quote Originally Posted by Poorlaggedman View Post
    I just wish it was more dynamic, dependent on the player's condition instead of the same general sway pattern. Maybe I'm wrong but that seems like what it is. I'd prefer the game attempt modeling adrenaline at various stages. Even to the point where one of these mobile juggernaut line spawns with colors that are coming actually spawn people in similar starting state. This way the best strategy is what everyone would benefit from, a more continuous front of lines that will fall back to recover rather than facing obliteration 98% of the time (reckless suicidal charges and stands). So what I'm getting at is if your line sprints from the spawn all the way to the fight, or otherwise exhausts itself, then the players who spawn on that line will be in a similar state of recovery from that exhaustion. Make the level of exhaustion and fatigue more dynamic. Life isn't as simple as "rush, rush, rush, gimme two minutes- okay I'm good." It all matters. Real-life: Your men are totally exhausted, adrenaline going though- they need water, you cross a stream on the way in to combat. Do you let them stop and get a drink? No, they'll crash and burn and the adrenaline will be gone. These things are complicated but they should be implemented on some small level because there is actually data out there.
    What Poor says makes a lot more sense than what is in game at the moment. I'll never agree that sway is the way to go for an un-injured non fatigued soldier.
    Last edited by Sox; 02-03-2018 at 12:57 AM.

  8. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by McMuffin View Post
    I'm gonna save everyone a lot of breath here, here you go Ragnar.

    Accuracy/Weapon Sway Thread
    Springfield 1842 Debate/Other Subjects you mention also
    Another weapon sway thread
    Specific Flag Bearer Thread

    For the morale penalties, here is everything you could wonder about it on the forums;
    Officers and morale
    Morale in general and how it should affect gameplay
    Sorry Mr Mcmuffin but all of those threads examine individual problems in isolation ... Sometimes it is a good idea to take a step back and study the bigger picture.

    What Im saying is that the current system needs to be altered. To try and find a solution by looking and each problem individually and out of context is in my opinion madness. Mr Trusty has already shown that if you alter one thing it affects others.

    small list of problems as i see them.

    1. excessive musket sway.
    2. sway becomes worse the farther from a group (makes sharpshooting and skirmishing almost impossible and useless). Marksmen "selected men" should not have their shooting affected by "in line" "out of line".
    3. Morale affected more by an individual being killed when separated from other troops i.e. when acting as a scout ... (why would this be???? would the men in line even know or care about this?).
    4. Forcing people to form line or at least a tight group (or risk being "out of line" and affecting morale) affects the tactical options open to officers.. sending out scouts is to risky (if they are killed morale takes a huge hit). If you cant send out scouts or skirmishers then you cant know where the enemy is coming from until they are close enough to be seen by the men in line.A good commander has his eyes all over the battlefield!
    5. Battles are to sporadic caused by the fact that troops spawn way back at the base spawns.
    5b. Attack and defence is very very difficult with the small numbers of troops available and those who have re-spawned have to travel some ways in order to rejoin the fight. (its very hard to keep pressure on the enemy).
    Last edited by ragnar hairy trousers; 02-03-2018 at 09:21 AM.
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  9. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by ragnar hairy trousers View Post
    Sorry Mr Mcmuffin but all of those threads examine individual problems in isolation ... Sometimes it is a good idea to take a step back and study the bigger picture.

    What Im saying is that the current system needs to be altered. To try and find a solution by looking and each problem individually and out of context is in my opinion madness. Mr Trusty has already shown that if you alter one thing it affects others.

    small list of problems as i see them.

    1. excessive musket sway.
    2. sway becomes worse the farther from a group (makes sharpshooting and skirmishing almost impossible and useless). Marksmen "selected men" should not have their shooting affected by "in line" "out of line".
    3. Morale affected more by an individual being killed when separated from other troops i.e. when acting as a scout ... (why would this be???? would the men in line even know or care about this?).
    4. Forcing people to form a line or at least a tight group (or risk being "out of line" and affecting morale) affects the tactical options open to officers.. sending out scouts is too risky (if they are killed morale takes a huge hit). If you cant send out scouts or skirmishers, then you cant know where the enemy is coming from until they are close enough to be seen by the men in line.A good commander has his eyes all over the battlefield!
    5. Battles are to sporadic caused by the fact that troops spawn way back at the base spawns.
    5b. Attack and defence is very very difficult with the small numbers of troops available and those who have re-spawned have to travel some ways in order to rejoin the fight. (its very hard to keep pressure on the enemy).
    Fair enough...I guess. The threads I linked all address your questions and concerns in one way or the other though and I linked you them so you could read the arguments and decisions reached on them, some are looking 'at the big picture' as you say.

    1) I agree that no matter the reason, the weapon sway outside of 'In Formation' is way too aggressive. The 'In Formation' buff would be much more realistic just to decrease morale loss and reduce the effects of suppression.
    2) See 1. If 'marksmen' would just loosely stay together (from my understanding, that was done), they can get the skirmishing buff and be fine.
    3) From my understanding, this is to encourage people from going rambo. To help with this, you can go into skirmishing formation with three or so people I believe and reduce morale loss and all that good stuff. And if you saw a bunch of guys not in formation and doing their own thing, it would most likely lower your morale as a person because your feeling of how well fellow units and soldiers can fight together would be reduced.
    4) Not really, while the system is slightly constraining, if an officer is going to lead a force to do something, chances are they have more than five people in relatively proximity to get the formation buff and be very effective. I have seen negligible amounts of tactical hinderance to officers from this system, nor have I heard of any complaints about it tactically hindering officers.
    5) Not sure what you mean. If you mean that battles are not constant on maps like they were in the Civil War, that is because often times there are not enough troops on one side at a specific moment to sustain long battle. That does not mean it never happens.
    5b) Server constraints right now are the cause of this, although, we have seen amazing progress in upping server player capacity.
    Last edited by McMuffin; 02-03-2018 at 03:35 PM.

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