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Thread: Prevent Rambo Spam

  1. #11

    USA General of the Army

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    Have always loved the Horse Test Idea of yours.

    Lol ... there is a point there ... BCoF looks better than WaT but, sadly, testing isn't really available at the moment.

    I definitely see WaT as a Line Battle Elitist (oops, Enthusiast) home. The tactic is appropriate in that time period but ...
    Honestly, we all know Pickett as an idiotic Fail Master for Gettysburg (at least those who don't study history) and the Civil War is not the period for this.

    Oh as a post scrip ...
    IMO, CG and the Guys are simply being swayed by the whines of the vocal parlor soldiers attempting to turn it into M&B because that is the game they understand and feel they can exploit.
    My tirade (the current one, at least. lol) is simply an attempt to point to the track we seem to be straying from.
    Last edited by John Cooley; 01-13-2019 at 02:34 PM.
    My Great Great Grandfather, Isaac MacDonal Cooley, served as a Pathfinder Cavalry Scout
    in the 1st Arkansas Cavalry Regiment (Dobbin's) Company K
    My Avatar flies his Unit Guidon to Honor his Service.
    My Credo is a simple one ... Unit before Self with Honor above ALL else.

  2. #12

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    What everyone here wants WoR to be, and what the general public wants it to be, is very, very different.

    Thay being said, OP sounds like a failed commander. Nobody in Hood's Brigade, II Corps, 17th Michigan, 72nd, yadda yadda etc. going on going on, has any issues managing the public players or responding to rambos. It's about proper formation management, and keeping your eyes open, NOT relying on tacked on game mechanics to keep you alive. There's a certain amount of skill required in this game, and if you can't hack it, you can't hack it. End of story.
    Just when I thought I was out...they pull me back in!

  3. #13

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    This may not be much of an answer, but I would just like to add this:

    The current games are skirmishes. We are all off to the side of main battles. In the distance you can hear large scale battle going on, but we are all scattered on the outskirts of the large combat lines. War is chaos. All of us broke off from main lines due to the absolute madness and brutality that is the American Civil War. We are everywhere trying to savagely kill each other. What little order there IS, is a godsend, but having people off in random positions adds to the chaos and makes it more realistic.

  4. #14

    USA General of the Army

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    Excellent Points ... both.

    The Community sets the standards and tone, adjusting where needed.
    We have seen many trolls come and go and the cream of the crop will be what remains ... eventually.
    My Great Great Grandfather, Isaac MacDonal Cooley, served as a Pathfinder Cavalry Scout
    in the 1st Arkansas Cavalry Regiment (Dobbin's) Company K
    My Avatar flies his Unit Guidon to Honor his Service.
    My Credo is a simple one ... Unit before Self with Honor above ALL else.

  5. #15
    WoR-Dev TrustyJam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leifr View Post
    It would be nice to have a little more transparency on this from CG, I feel like we're at the point in Early Access where some future plans need to be laid out for discussion. Heck if I know what's happening any more...
    https://steamcommunity.com/games/424...84000970084255

    The above are our future plans.

    - Trusty

  6. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by John Cooley View Post
    Please stop trying to invent even more restrictive game mechanics as this game is going from being a great Civil War game and becoming one of the most one-dimensional games ever.
    Encouraging (nay, FORCING) unimaginative, repetitive tactics that were proven stupid and ineffective in the American Civil War makes it a boring repeat of every other skirm fought.
    A big reason I keep pushing the game to be designed so that a denser formation has certain advantages is so that people can play alone and not be the hated/banned which means it shouldn't be easy. Contrary to what some people say, it really is as evidence by the constant breakdown of order in close range combat when any sort of cover is involved at all. People dart around tree to tree and zig zag and try to come into enemy lines at an angle into certain death. Spectating it's like being in a casino watching someone make a risky gamble that never pays off. Only the players making the suicidal gambles aren't losing anything and get to come right back to the table to make the same stupid gambles again, it's just detracting from everyone else's experience and enjoyment.

    The "line battle" culture is very mundane I think but a lot of the reason is in the forced nature of it. Skirmishing is seen as dishonorable is because there really is no major discernible advantage to tighter formations. The thought of the soldier in line encountering some skirmishers should be "Good, only skirmishers." Not "This isn't fair, it's skirmishers." When skirmishers who are acting a fool decide fight a pitched battle with a line of equal or greater size and get silenced consistently then the attitude will start to change.

    The way I envision it is that nothing would change in the ballistics so obviously you're statistically less likely to die when loose, but you're also more vulnerable to suppression. If you're getting volleys blasted at you by twice your number, you shouldn't be okay and shouldn't recover in time for the next one. The more firepower you take the more compelled you are to get closer and the faster you spawn in with the more people you have in a closer formation to represent the staying power of the formation you formed. Isolated players shouldn't be doing much combat and not very effectively after the second bullet whizzes by them in a few seconds.

    The clusterfuck we sometimes have in game is the power of individuality when it's not countered.

    There are few exceptions but soldiers did not fight alone in the Civil War, certainly not against numerous enemy. You might take a shot, but then you run. That's not happening. Joe Rambo has just as good a chance of killing one enemy up close in hand-to-hand as he does of getting skewered himself and that's not right. This isn't Guadalcanal, it's Maryland. These guys surrendered and sometimes they were paroled and marching off unguarded the next day. Not only did they not have a duty to fight to the death but it was hotly frowned upon when soldiers refused surrender demands in hopeless situations.

    Persistent reckless suicidal aggression is a problem many games refuse to face and I think a lot of people agree that it get's really, really, really old. I'm all about individuality done right. I would feel like a total disgrace going around alone like some people do running up behind a line stabbing someone and disrupting a whole formation, maybe killing it's leader at close range. The entire meelee system by default, and without heavy work, does disservice to the real conflict in a lot of ways because it doesn't simulate the conditions in any respect. I'd bet the house that more guys get skewered with a bayonet thrust in your average WoR full server round than did in the entire battle of Antietam or Gettysburg combined. If you don't try and simulate what the real soldiers went through, you get chaos that doesn't resemble the very thing being modeled every time.


    I just don't see Cavalry or Artillery being viable in a type of role they deserve without a miracle breakthrough on server performance and destructible environments. Then again I never saw 150 player servers coming. If you can't break down a fence then you can't maneuver for either branch. If you can't maneuver then what's the point? Players could jump on a battery and have the fuzes, ranges, and bearing to known targets already memorized. Fences would bottleneck Cavalry. You could have all cavalry maps later down the road. I don't look at WoR as an Antietam game, it's the best we have for the Civil War. Any custom content later on will make other campaigns doable even if official ones aren't done.
    Last edited by Poorlaggedman; 01-14-2019 at 05:13 AM.
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  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by TrustyJam View Post
    https://steamcommunity.com/games/424...84000970084255

    The above are our future plans.

    - Trusty
    Sure, most of those were outlined fairly clearly in the original Kickstarter over two years ago and aren't unknowns to most people. I am suggesting more the present and the near future, something closer to Deep Rock Galactic's roadmap. Heck, a mundane update once a week on what the team have been working on (yes, even server fixes!) would be nice. Right now I'm shit out of luck on what to tell even my own men what to expect in the future - it's feeling stale. This is wildly off-topic though, I'll leave this here.

    PLM is bang on, as usual.

  8. #18

    USA General of the Army

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    Quote Originally Posted by Leifr View Post
    PLM is bang on, as usual.
    As Usual.
    My Great Great Grandfather, Isaac MacDonal Cooley, served as a Pathfinder Cavalry Scout
    in the 1st Arkansas Cavalry Regiment (Dobbin's) Company K
    My Avatar flies his Unit Guidon to Honor his Service.
    My Credo is a simple one ... Unit before Self with Honor above ALL else.

  9. #19
    WoR-Dev TrustyJam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leifr View Post
    Sure, most of those were outlined fairly clearly in the original Kickstarter over two years ago and aren't unknowns to most people. I am suggesting more the present and the near future, something closer to Deep Rock Galactic's roadmap. Heck, a mundane update once a week on what the team have been working on (yes, even server fixes!) would be nice. Right now I'm shit out of luck on what to tell even my own men what to expect in the future - it's feeling stale. This is wildly off-topic though, I'll leave this here.

    PLM is bang on, as usual.
    We're currently releasing one alpha update a week roughly.

    You can treat the patchnotes as your weekly progress update and use the roadmap to get an idea of the overall targets.

    - Trusty

  10. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by TrustyJam View Post
    We're currently releasing one alpha update a week roughly.

    You can treat the patchnotes as your weekly progress update and use the roadmap to get an idea of the overall targets.

    - Trusty
    The published Roadmap is about new features and technical improvements, not fundamental gameplay design issues we all know exist and need addressing.

    Most of the ideas in this forum actually go towards addressing gameplay shortcomings (by that I mean how we play WoR).

    Examples; nothing specifically in the Roadmap addresses the issue of how we will select Officers in the future.

    Or in the case of this thread there’s nothing I can see in the Roadmap that will address the issue of further reigning in Rambos/lone wolves.
    Last edited by Quaker; 01-14-2019 at 06:42 PM.

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